Benteen's Duty

[BrokenSword]

Elisabeth-

Kilmer sparkled in that role, didn't he? Small errors are usually nothing in themselves, and, in my opinion, add to the fun.

I don't know what you might consider to be a 'good' movie. 'Wyatt Earp' is darker in nature than 'Tombstone.' It is more accurate historically, and the characters are closer to the true personalities of the figures involved. I would call it good, but not, perhaps, as much fun. Certainly worth the time to watch.

M

[elisabeth]

Yes, dazzling stuff.

I'm all for "dark" movies, so that sounds promising; misgivings only because I find Kostner a rather dull actor on the whole. But the rest of the cast is sound, so I'll give it a go.

On the "Benteen's Duty" question, it might interesting to switch it around for a moment and consider what Custer's duty was. Obviously, first and foremost it was to the mission he'd been given. But within that:
* Did he have a duty to notify Terry he was attacking ahead of schedule?
* Did he have a duty to let Reno know about his changed plan of attack, the move north?
* If he wanted Benteen to join him, did he have a duty to advise Benteen that Reno had been detached -- to avoid the foreseeable confusion?
* Did he have a duty to keep himself informed of the progress or otherwise of Reno's battalion?
* Did he have a duty to adopt a command position to oversee the whole battle, rather than acting like a battalion commander?
* If he went to Ford D, did he have a duty to leave observers to keep him informed of what was happening with Keogh's battalion, what signs there were of Benteen's approach, etc.?
* Above all, did he have a duty to try to extricate his command once things began to go wrong -- by retreating either south to his support, or north to Terry?

[harpskiddie]

Why not start a new thread? This one has already degenerated into trivia, more or less, as they always seem to do. "Custer's Duty" will surely start a fire raging.

Gordie
MC

[douglas]

Mike, I may be missing your point, but I don't see where Gray was so terribly wrong. He has Herendeen talking with Reno on Reno Hill. You say that he is claiming that the Reno advance has not started at that time.I don't see any claim about the advance.He is saying that Reno himself was still at or very near Reno Hill. I don't see any evidence that Reno ever moved far from Reno Hill. Hare went to Weir point then came back to report to Reno. Benteen left Weir Point to go back to talk with Reno.A troop and the wounded didn't move far from Reno Hill. Why do think Reno did?

[mcaryf]

Hi Douglas

John Gray changes or falsifies Herendeen's statement to make him say that he met Reno on Reno Hill. what Herendeen actually said was that he met Reno well along the bluff from Reno Hill at the head of his column advancing to Weir Peaks.

Gray uses his false evidence to criticise Reno for not having advanced earlier. He clearly says that Reno's meeting with Herendeen was on Reno Hill and uses that as proof that Reno's advance had not started by then.

If you look at the detailed evidence re the time for the actions on those bluffs Reno's actual advance was probably of the order of 30 minutes earlier than Gray claimed and probably only about 15 to 30 minutes after the main element of the pack train started to come up. Reno actually halted the advance of the pack train waiting for Herendeen to come up the bluff to him. Of course Benteen and 4 companies had already got to Weir Peaks by then and Reno was just leading up the remnants.

There is evidence that Reno himself continued to Weir Peaks and met Benteen there.

Weir Peaks was only just over a mile from Reno Hill so wherever Reno was between the two he was not far from either.

My point about John Gray getting the times horrendously wrong is because he assumed that Wallace was using local time when in fact he was most probably using St Paul time which is 1hr 20 minutes different from local. As a result of this assumption pretty well every time John Gray used in his timelines is actually incorrect in the context in which he used it.

Regards

Mike

[darkmoon]

Custer had assigned him the advance shortly after crossing the divide.

"The duties of the advanced guard are many, depending on what it FINDS when (NOT IF) it makes contact. If it actually attacks or is itself attaked, the enemy is compelled to show his hand more or less and this betrays to the commander of the main body some of the things he must know before he can make an intelligent disposition of his force for the principal action." This explanation of Benteens duties as an "advance guard" were outlined in Charles Kuhlman's Custer and Gall Saga, where he was aided in this effort by Captain E.S Luce and Brig. Gen. H. G. Hawkins.

[conz]

Darkmoon,

That IS an excellent statement of the duties of an Advance Guard, but I don't think Benteen ever was performing this mission. He war, rather, a flank guard, or even a scout.

I believe Reno was given the Advance Guard mission, and he as much said so at the RCOI. So apply that definition to his duty, and you've got good insight into what Reno knew he was supposed to do.

Clair