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Post by montrose on Apr 30, 2015 12:35:58 GMT -6
I spent 2 weeks in The local Veteran's Admin hospital. One of my sisters found an ACW book in a used book store for 5$ and it was the only thing I had to read for over a week. Of all things it was a volume of the Official Records which is some 200 volumes. It was Series I Volume 38 Operations in Georgia 1 May to 8 Sep 64.
The book contains the Army of the Cumberland Cavalry reports from this campaign. I see many relevant observations and lessons learned relevant to this board. By the way, Keogh is mentioned, as this is when SToneman and his staff surrendered due to a tactical blunder (Stoneman's, not young buck Irish dude).
I am at home recovering so the VA can cut me some more. I am reading Frederick the Great's instructions to his generals. Again, very interesting to read. He goes on at length on how to select and train cavalry officers, and how to manage cavalry units. Freddy would have pacified the West in 3-4 years, he has a brilliant ability to adapt his force to the local conditions.
SO I intend to use this thread to outline issues related to manning, training and equipping cavalry units for campaigns and battle.
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Post by tubman13 on Apr 30, 2015 13:10:06 GMT -6
Montrose,
Sorry to hear about your stint in the VA hospital. I hope you are on the mend.
We hear a good deal about ACW cavalry operations in Virginia and to a lesser degree in Kansas/Missouri. It takes some work to dig out actions in the deep south. Keogh spent 2.5 months in Confederate hands and was exchanged and returned to action for the close of the war as I recall, Sherman made this happen. As I understand it Keogh should have gotten a brevet fo the battle of Dallas, GA.
Again, be well, and update us.
Regards, Tom
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Post by dave on Apr 30, 2015 13:42:57 GMT -6
Will Hope everything is better and you won't need much further surgery. I have had 3 knee surgeries and a tendon surgery in the last 3 years and hope to stay out of the hospital for the future. Back to the War. NB Forrest was very active here in North Mississippi and West Tennessee from April through December 1864. From Fort Pillow to Brice's Crossroads to Tupelo to the Second Battle of Memphis to the Battle of Johnsonville to the Battle of Franklin and the Battle of Nashville. You will certainly run across Forrest and his command in your Official Records. I would love to hear your professional opinion as to Forrest's actions, his use of tactics and choices of targets during this 1864 period mentioned above. Would Forrest been able to handle the 7th at LBH or would the indian warfare been beyond his skill set? I look forward to your posts. Regards Dave
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Post by Beth on Apr 30, 2015 15:12:28 GMT -6
Montrose, I've been missing you! Sorry to hear you were in the hospital though.
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Post by mac on Apr 30, 2015 17:29:41 GMT -6
All the best montrose! Lookforward to hearing from you. Cheers
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Post by fred on May 1, 2015 6:24:33 GMT -6
SO I intend to use this thread to outline issues related to manning, training and equipping cavalry units for campaigns and battle. Careful, Will. Remember all these cavalry "experts." Hope you are feeling better. Very best wishes, Fred.
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Post by Yan Taylor on May 1, 2015 7:05:17 GMT -6
Keep going William. Look forward to your next post.
Ian.
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Post by montrose on May 1, 2015 12:29:52 GMT -6
My first observation is that animal management is a huge factor in this era. It is amusing that Rinni and Conzelman are completely blind to this.
The 7th Pennsylvania Cavalry has a report that illustrates this.
Started with 919 horses, and captured 43.
230 died or were abandoned as they fell out 171 were killed or captured, but really this is a lame excuse. All were abandoned.
So 961 animals at the start became 560 at the end, with start being 30 Apr 64, end being 13 Sep 64.
Animals need management and leadership. You can run vehicles until they run out of gas. You can run men to extreme conditions through leadership. You abuse animals, and they die. The reports I am reviewing show animal losses exceed human losses on average by 10 to 1. But ratios of 100 to one are frequent.
People who do not understand cavalry operations, meaning Conzelman, Rinni and that crowd, deride and make fun of units that manage their animal assets. Crook was a master at this. Look at his leadership, and how he manned, trained and equipped his units to optimize animal assets.
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Post by tubman13 on May 1, 2015 12:52:22 GMT -6
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Post by jodak on May 1, 2015 12:57:07 GMT -6
As a tangent to this, I have recently been reading through Franz Halder's war journals, and one thing that caught my attention was that as late as WW2 the German army was still devoting considerable attention to equine resources and management, since much of their transport was still based upon that. As one example that stood out, during the Battle of France there was an outbreak of equine influenza in one regiment that immobilized it for a few days, necessitating some modification of plans and shifting of resources, and you have to wonder what would have been the end result if the problem had been more widespread. "For want of the horse...."
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Post by montrose on May 1, 2015 13:06:41 GMT -6
Animals remain part of modern war.
My operational detachment alpha underwent mule training in 1993. I missed this, due to Somalia.
In my personal experience, I have worked with several Armies who still use animals. This includes Morocco, Namibia, South Africa, Malawi, Mozambique.
Steve is a major player here, and he uses animals to support USA national objectives.
I believe we can benefit from a discussion of animals in war and law enforcement.
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Post by fred on May 2, 2015 6:37:50 GMT -6
... I have recently been reading through Franz Halder's war journals, and one thing that caught my attention was that as late as WW2 the German army was still devoting considerable attention to equine resources and management, since much of their transport was still based upon that. Jodak, Nice post. And you are correct. All through the war, the German army relied on animals, even in their motorized divisions which then turned into panzer grenadier divisions, then some into panzer divisions, they used animals: mules and horses. Many of the mech units were really still motorized, using trucks rather than APCs. One of the interesting things I learned from the Germans when I commanded German troops back in the 1960s is about their trucks. Take a look at pictures of German vehicles in Russia and France during WWII. Check out their tire size. Now check out the modern German trucks and see how much bigger tire size is. They learned this from being stuck in the Russian mud, one of several primary reasons for their loss in Russia. Best wishes, Fred.
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Post by quincannon on May 2, 2015 9:22:50 GMT -6
I do not believe anyone here, regardless of background would be disputing or even discussing the necessity to care and maintain a weapon, use it within its designed parameters, maximizing its attributes, and employ it in such a manner as to minimize its shortcomings. The weapon is a piece of military equipment.
The horse, when utilized by the military is a piece of military equipment, nothing more. You must manage your assets, to maximize your combat power.
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Post by Yan Taylor on May 2, 2015 12:04:50 GMT -6
Here is a good example on the Germans reliance on horses. linkTruck wise the Germans simply took any vehicles they captured in that particular country, when the Germans were fully committed in Russia then it wouldn’t surprize me to find trucks from any number of the countries that they controlled, in most cases they simply ran them until they ran out of spares and then destroyed them. Ian.
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Post by jodak on May 2, 2015 14:45:26 GMT -6
Halder had many, many notations concerning trucks, and it is evident that they were of great concern to the German high command. There are numerous entries about meetings and efforts at the highest levels to secure much greater numbers through increased production, absorption of captured assets, and even re-purposing of civilian vehicles. This was a problem that the Germans never solved and haunted them throughout the war. I am of the opinion that one of the most important "weapons" that the allies had was the American trucks, particularly the 2.5 ton Studebaker.
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