Ft. Phil Kearney

[markland]

Since it is almost the anniversary (plus the wife has not given a definitive NO to my going there) a reminder of how things were. From Col. Carrington's report of the Fetterman battle.

"I was asked to “send all the bad news”. I do it as far as I can. I give some of the facts as to my men whose bodies I found just at dark, resolved to bring all in viz: -

Mutilations

Eyes torn out and laid on the rocks.
Noses cut off.
Ears cut off.
Chins hewn off.
Teeth chopped out.
Joints of fingers. [sic]
Brains taken out and placed on rocks with other members of the body.
Entrails taken out and exposed.
Hands cut off.
Feet cut off.
Arms taken out from socket.
Private parts severed and indecently placed on the person.
Eyes, ears, mouth, and arms penetrated with spear heads, sticks and arrows.
Ribs slashed to separation with knifes.
Sculls [sic] severed in every form from chin to crown.
Muscles of calves, thighs, stomach, breast, back, arms and cheek, taken out.
Punctures upon every sensitive part of the body, even to the soles of the feet and palms of the hand.

All this only approximates to the whole truth."


So much for civilized warfare, ehhh? Please remember that image is what every soldier rode with during the Indian Wars period. Brutality received, brutality given.

Billy

[bubbabod]

Billy Markland: "Since it is almost the anniversary (plus the wife has not given a definitive NO to my going there) a reminder of how things were. From Col. Carrington's report of the Fetterman battle."

Billy, are/were you thinking of making the annual trip to the Fetterman Battle site on the anniversary of the fight? That's something I've always wanted to do. If you make it, I'd love to hear about it. Good luck.

[Scout]

Yea, that sounds like the results of a "battle" to me.

[crzhrs]

I guess it's okay to have bodies maimed and blown apart by cannon and other heavy artillery, but chopping up dead bodies is not?

I believe Carrington pondered why Indians resorted to mutilations but I don't think he ever revealed what he thought.

[Scout]

Oh yes, chopping up bodies is totally acceptable. Isn't that an apples to oranges comparison?

[crzhrs]

Chopping up bodies has been part of combat for thousands of years. Whether acceptable or not (depending on cultural practices) it is not immune from any culture, even so-called civilized ones.

[elisabeth]

It was standard practice in this country, until quite recent centuries, to cut off and display the heads of traitors over the city gates, to leave the bodies of highwaymen hanging in chains from gibbets at crossroads for years at a time, and so on. Hanging, drawing and quartering, for instance, which was far from nice. The aim of it all was to sow terror and to act as a warning to others. Same thing with the Fetterman fight, perhaps. (And it worked. The forts were closed down.) There's also an element of contempt in the elaborateness of some of the Fetterman mutilations, isn't there -- the message possibly being "look how much leisure you gave us before you did anything to help your comrades". Not a message that poor Carrington would hasten to take on board, I think ...

[harpskiddie]

Billy:

I hope that you get to go; that you get some snow on the ground to give you a better "feel" for the terrain they faced and fought over; and that your nights are not filled with visions of severed whatevers.

I know you've been there before, but I recall that you were not blessed with snow. I've never been there in winter. Not too far away; but not THERE. I rode past the site several times one summer, without knowing it was there, since there was nothing at all to indicate that a fort had stood there, or that a fight had occurred not far away. First I knew of it was spotting the monument one day, and going up to see what it was. The last time I was at the site was sometime in the early '80s, and my wife wondered what in heck I was looking for, or at. I think at that time they had erected a small explanatory sign, but there was still no sign of a fort - just a large flat place. The monument was littered with beer cans and broken bottles.

Gordie
MC

[crawdaddo]

I would like to say any photos of the fetterman site would be gratefully appreciated if anybody cares to post them.thanks

[gocav76]

Crawdaddo, Here are some pics from a great site-has Rev War, Civil War, and Indian War photo tours. johnsmilitaryhistory.com/fetterman.html Here is a video clip-the sound is not too good at times. www.youtube.com/watch?v=YC-TFz4yVqQ

[harpskiddie]

Great photos and a nice job, Larry. Thanks.

Gordie
MC

[gocav76]

Thanks Gordie! That has to be the most haunting place I've seen! I would hate to camp out overnight there. Its a place I have to see for myself someday! Larry

[markland]

scout2 said:

Yea, that sounds like the results of a "battle" to me.

The aftermath of a battle fought against people with different beliefs. Somewhere in the Ft. Phil Kearny (I misspelled it for crying out loud!) there is speculation by either Carrington or one of the doctors at the fort that not all the men were dead at the time of the mutilations and some were tortured to death. I'll try to dig it up as I plan this weekend to file all the papers and books scattered around the office.

Billy

P.S. Someone somewhere mentioned a paper that Carrington presented to a royal academy or society dealing with the battle. It was entitled, "The Indian Question" and did go into some detail about the relationship between specific mutilations and the Indians' religious beliefs. I would post it but first, I can't find it and secondly, one page is missing which will entail a trip over to Topeka to have that page recopied.

[conz]

Didn't the various Native tribes chop each other up just as they did the wasichus?

For that matter, wasn't mutilating one's wife for adultery also a not uncommon Native cultural trait?

I don't think the Natives were doing anything to the cavalry that they hadn't done for decades against each other, right?

Clair

[crawdaddo]

Thankyou gocav that is an excellent site, really great photos' and they really convey the remoteness of the fort.It must have been incredibly hard for the soldiers posted there to deal with anyway thanks again....