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Post by fred on Oct 15, 2007 12:03:21 GMT -6
As the Dakota column moved west, had anything changed, any messages, any news, any new intelligence? Was the mission still the same or had something changed?
Where were the Indians and what were they doing? Did they know of the soldiers' presence? Did they care? Was there movement among tribes at the agencies?
What were the agencies and how many of them were there? What was a summer-roamer and what was a winter-roamer? Did the military and the government lump all these tribes and these so-called "roamers" into one category?
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Post by fred on Oct 15, 2007 12:51:29 GMT -6
The Chicago Times—in a May 24, 1876, article—reported, “In all there are Cheyennes, Sioux, and others, some 3,000 ready to fight out this campaign against Gen. Crook. They have numerous allies and people well-informed place the actual hostile Indian camp at from 7,000 to 8,000 first class fighting men…” [Willert, LBH Diary, p. 44]
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Post by clw on Oct 15, 2007 13:32:24 GMT -6
This quote from George Hyde's Red Cloud's Folk is interesting....
"In the middle of May, Gibbon was in actual contact with the hostiles near the mouth of the Rosebud. The whole country south of the Yellowstone seemed to swarm with Indians. Terry, with Custer and his Seventh Calvary, had at last taken the field. Terry left FAL ...... on May 17, but his movements were so retarded by his large wagon train that he did not reach the Little Missouri until twelve days later. Here he spent some time in hunting for Sitting Bull, who, as he had been informed, was wintering in this vacinity. What kind of comander was this who would try to find the Sioux in their winter camps at the end of May? To add to the ludicrousness of the situation, Terry now ordered Gibbon to hurry down the Yellowstone, and to assist him in hunting Sitting Bull on the little Missouri, and Gibbon, with Sitting Bull almost in plain site just across the river, had to obey."
Bradley, of Gibbon's column, reported the smoke of a great hostile camp on the Rosebud about 18 miles above the mouth of the stream on May 27. Hyde goes on to state that these Indians that Gibbon was encountering were "the bands that wintered in the Powder River country, their camp on the Tongue showed 360 lodges formed into several circles. - Mitch Boyer reported nine circles, but he may have been mistaken. On the Rosebud the hostiles were joined by the Indians from the agencies with approximately five hundred lodges, making the entire hostile force with extra people, who had no lodges, about nine hundred logdes, perhaps 2,000 warriors in all."
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Post by fred on Oct 16, 2007 8:25:45 GMT -6
May 24: Bright, clear, very warm; rolling prairie. 19 miles and camp at 2 p.m. The column is now out about 102 miles from Fort Abraham Lincoln.
May 25: Mild and clear, about 48 degrees. By mid-day, temperatures had risen to 74 (F). 20 miles.
May 26: Mail arrives. Mostly uphill, but easy, to an "alkaline plain covered with cactus and prickly pear." Beds of red gravel. Hottest day-- 79-- highest elevation: 3,279 feet. 12 miles.
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Post by conz on Oct 18, 2007 8:53:37 GMT -6
Out of Bray's CH:
"Processing all reports, Crazy Horse and the other chiefs ordered the villages moved slowly upstream [from the mouth of the Rosebud] on May 25."
Clair
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Post by conz on Oct 18, 2007 9:43:06 GMT -6
As to where the winter camps were, Bray says that after the Reynold's raid..."after five days of recuperation, heralds ordered the camp struck, and the procession angled northwest along the Powder divide to Sitting Bull's village in the Blue Earth Hills."
This was about six days after the raid when the survivors showed up at CH's camp.
So about late April, the winter camps were breaking up and looking for buffalo..."Turning west over the greening divide, the growing village - now exceeding four hundred lodges - camped on Tongue River through early May. As ponies fattened, hunters made successful surrounds. Messengers including Little Big Man were dispatched to the agencies. 'It is war,' they declared, inviting all to attend the Northern Nation Sun Dance on the Rosebud in early June."
So maybe Terry wasn't catching them in the winter camps, but the Natives weren't that far away...in fact, they had moved closer to Terry after breaking their winter fast, and Terry was headed right towards them. Not too shabby...
Clair
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Post by crzhrs on Oct 18, 2007 9:55:15 GMT -6
<in fact, they had moved closer to Terry>
Apparently the Indians were not fearful of soldiers roaming around and may have even wanted to fight them rather than avoid them. Maybe it was Terry who was inept in finding the Indians.
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Post by conz on Oct 18, 2007 10:45:25 GMT -6
<in fact, they had moved closer to Terry> Apparently the Indians were not fearful of soldiers roaming around and may have even wanted to fight them rather than avoid them. Maybe it was Terry who was inept in finding the Indians. The interesting factor here is that the cavalry would not send out small scouting parties all over the plains...rarely out of sight of the main body. Natives, when they were so inclined, did not follow this restriction. Normally we would say that in the Art of War this means the Natives have won the "reconnaissance" fight, using cavalry screens to deny intel to the enemy, and gaining it for yourself. Trouble with Native scouting is that it was not very organized, so there were often gaps in surveillance as professionals would say. In the end, neither side gets much actionable intelligence for operational-level decisions. So the Natives often missed Terry, and Terry certainly missed all the agency villages moving parallel to him towards the west, a few dozen miles to the south of his route all that month. Clair
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