Hunkpapa Bands at LBH?

[fred]

Ephriam--

Thanks!! I'm heading there now.

Best wishes,
Fred.

[Dietmar]

According to Utley and several other sources some of the most prominent Hunkpapa headman in the Canada exile were Long Dog, Little Knife, The Crow and Iron Dog.
Little Knife is said to be one of the first of the Teton sioux leaders to settle across the border.
I didn´t find their names in this thread, yet.
Perhaps they were just leading warriors but not band chiefs?
Also I haven´t found their names on the 1885 Standing Rock annuity list. What happened to them after returning to the U.S.? (I only know of Long Dog, who often was photographed by D.F.Barry)

Does anyone know more about these Hunkpapa leaders?

Thanks, Dietmar

[Dietmar]

Here is a source of some more names of Teton leaders at a conference in Canada (some of them might had been at the LBH?):

FORT WALSH, October 17, 1877.
The commission assembled at 3 o'clock p. m. in Major Walsh's quarters. Present: General Terry, General Lawrence, Capt. H. C. Corbin, and Mr. Jay Stone, a stenographer.
Lieutenant-Colonel McLeod, Major Walsh, and other officers of the mounted police were also present.
The Indian chiefs were then brought is and their names announced, as follows: Bear's Head, head chief of the Uncapapas ; Sitting Bull, The Spotted Eagle, The Flying Bird, The Whirlwind Bear, The Medicine-turns-around, The Iron, Dog, The-man-that-scatters-the-Bear Little Knife, The Crow, and Yellow Dog.

www.misu.nodak.edu/library/ecollections/SittingBull/text.htm

[ephriam]

Dietmar:

I have a little more information on several of the Hunkpapa that you inquired about.

Both Long Dog (Sunka Hanska; born circa. 1821) and Iron Dog (Sunka Maza; born c1813-14) are listed in Crow King's band in the Sitting Bull Surrender Census in 1881.

They apparently surrendered with Crow King, arriving at Poplar Creek Jan. 20, 1881 and at Fort Buford on Feb. 5, 1881; transferred to Fort Yates, arriving May 29; turned over to Standing Rock Agency on July 21, 1881.

Long Dog is listed in records in Crow King's band through Dec. 1881, but I have not found a record for him after that. Iron Dog is listed in the records in Crow King's band, then later in High Bear's Band (Crow King's successor) through 1887. Presumably he died in late 1887 or early 1888.

Crow is listed in the Sitting Bull Surrender Ledger in Gall's Band. There is no Hunkpapa named Little Knife listed, through there is a Little Knife (born c1816) listed in Hump's band of Minneconjou in 1881.

Ephriam

[grahamew]

This is a painting based on the photograph of Crow. I know his image is on the net somewhere, but I can't find where at the moment.

[shan]

Ephriam,

Ephriam, a belated thanks for the information on the two Low Dogs you posted some time back, I have been away, and then came back to trouble with the computor With regards to that reference to a Low Dog that surrendered at the Spotted Tail agency 1877 specifically his being a Brule, this certainly muddies the water, as it seems to imply that there may have been 3 Low Dogs.
I know that their is a reference to a Low Dog the Brule in Colemans, Voices at wounded Knee, where he sites McLaughlin as wanting, " the removal of Sitting Bull, Circling Bear, Black Bird, and Circling Hawk of his agency, Big Foot and his lieutenants at Cheyenne river; Crow Dog and Low Dog of Rosebud; and any of like ilk of Pine Ridge." I had pompously assumed that the writer might have got the tribal designation wrong, but perhaps it's me.
Another question to pester you with. The man known as No two Horns, who was a cousin of Sitting Bull, seems to have left a lot of drawings scattered about. Do you know if these all come from one source, i.e. a ledger book? Come to think of it, I have never seen photograph of the man, do you know if any exist?

once again, thank you for your time,
Shan

[grahamew]

Found him in the SIRS archive, although he's named as Crow King (but not in the notation where he's referred to as Crow, in the Custer fight) here and i think the notation suggests he's Oglala, unless it refers to an image that had been pasted above:

[grahamew]

Shan,

There's information to suggest that the drawings do come from a ledger book on www.archimuse.com/mw2004/abstracts/prg_250000737.html

Hang on, this is better: www.state.nd.us/hist/museumStore/proddetail.asp?prod=3343

[Dietmar]

Ephriam,
thank you very much for the information!

Thank you also, Grahame, I always wondered, if this photo of Crow is the Hunkpapa, although it is labeled different often, as you mentioned.

[kingsleybray]

On the Low Dog sub-thread: I remain convinced that the famous Low Dog is the Low Dog (or "Law Dog") listed in the Spotted Tail Agency census as surrendering from the north on Sept. 4, 1877, with the advance guard of Fast Bull's camp (formerly Lame Deer's). This is because Wm. Garnett in his 1907 interview with Judge Ricker stated that Low Dog led the breakout for Canada during the agency removal to the Missouri River, Nov. 1877. Garnett stated: "Low Dog, a northern chief an upstart who belonged to the Lame Deer band and was a brave man, he led these Indians off." Granted that probably all these Indians had multiple names, but no one else in the Fast Bull camp is listed as Low Dog. Ephriam is right, the name seems to read 'Law Dog', but what I suspect you have here is the master census roll being copied from more rudimentary field entries. This particular census has many obvious misreadings or mis-spellings, often confounding 'o' and 'a'.

Incidentally, what is dramatic here is the fact that the bunch of people including Low Dog (the headman was noted as Shedding Bear, a Miniconjou) had joined the Northern village on Beaver Creek below Spotted Tail Agency late on Sept. 3. With three of the four Northern village Deciders they came up to the agency on the morning of the fourth to be enrolled. At precisely the same time the Army had marched from Camp Robinson in its bid to arrest Crazy Horse, who of course fled to the Northern village at Spotted Tail. My hunch is that Crazy Horse knew of the surrender of Fast Bull's camp, and hoped to tip the fragile balance in the Northern village and provoke a general outbreak. In this of course he failed.

We know nothing about Low Dog's parentage, so he may have counted Wazhazha/Brule antecedents. He seems to have been unusually well-travelled even by contemporary Lakota standards, having connections to the Hunkpapa and Miniconjou as well as the Oyuhpe band of Oglalas with whom he usually "ran". He seems never to have settled permanently at any one agency even after the final surrenders of 1881 - so I suspect he is the Low Dog counted as a Ghost Dance agitator at Rosebud. Clearly a lot more research waits to be done on his remarkable life. The astonishing photo of him with the short hair, side parting - and I don't think he looks remotely subservient or 'tamed' - is one more proof of the man's elusive, mercurial quality.

Hope this helps

Kingsley

[kingsleybray]

Reading the 'Report of the Sitting Bull Commission' kindly posted by Dietmar, I was reminded of the prominence of Bear's Head in that period - the document actually calls him the head chief of the Hunkpapa. Perhaps he was one of the Deciders (Wakicunze) appointed for that year in the non-treaty Hunkpapa village once it reconstituted in Canada? I think Pretty Bear is also accorded prominence in this period too - again, he seems to fall into relative obscurity.

A question for Ephriam: does Bear's Head occur in the Sitting Bull Surrender Ledger and/or subsequent Standing Rock censuses. If so, what band?

Kingsley

[ephriam]

Dietmar:

You asked earlier why Crow did not appear in the July 1885 Annuity List for the Standing Rock Agency. Actually, his family is there, but Crow himself appears to have died in either late 1884 or early 1885. His 18 year old son, Kill with Anger, is listed as chief and most of Crow's band are shown following him: families such as Pushing Around Holy, Lump on Leg, Spotted Weasel, etc.

As you already known from Utley (1993), Crow surrendered with Gall. They arrived at Poplar Agency in late November 1880; were surrounded by Major Ilges in early Jan. 1881 and then forced to walk to Fort Buford where they arrived Jan. 10, 1881. They were then loaded on steamers on May 26 and arrived at Fort Yates on May 29; then turned over to agency officials at Standing Rock Agency on July 21, 1881.

In the Sitting Bull Surrender Census, Sept. 1881, Crow is listed in Gall's band. He is 46 years of age (born circa 1835), with his wife and three sons. Crow is listed in Gall's band in the annuity and issue records for 1881, 1882 and early 1883. By November 1883, however, Crow's band is listed seperate from Gall, with 22 families/78 people. Crow's band is listed through the 1884 records.

I have not gone through the early 1885 issue records yet. However, by June-July 1885, when both the agency census and the annuity list were created, Crow was gone. His wife and three sons are still shown, with the eldest son (known earlier as Kola but now known as Kill with Anger) as chief.

By the time of the 1886 census, Crow's band has scattered, the families joining various other Hunkpapa bands at the agency. This is very typical. With the death of a prominent leader, a band often disintegrated and its members scattered to join other relatives. We can document this process in the Standing Rock Agency records for several bands, including Crow's, Black Moon's, Four Horns and Long Soldier's.

Also, there is a more complete example of Crow's portrait by Barry in the Denver Public Library. You can pull it up on their photo website.

Ephriam

[shan]

Thanks for that information Kingsley, mana from heaven for a man trying to root out any little clue on Low Dog.
I too am pretty sure that my man Low Dog is the same man as the Low Dog the Brule, mistakes are easily made by all of us. As an example, a piece of information I came across referred to a request to arrest a Lodog, probably Low Dog, Big Foot, Pretty Hawk and Hump, this being just prior to Ghost Dance outbreak, the reasons given was that they were thought to be potential trouble makers. Low Dog was eventually arrested almost immediately after the fighting, apparently because he tried to " kidnap a boy who had been brought from Pine Ridge as a prisoner, along with a few survivors. " Low Dog was eventually imprisoned at Fort Snelling, where incidentally, I think that photograph of him with short hair was taken.
Attached to this information, was a newspaper clipping about the arrest and its subsequent outcome, which mistakenly named the man arrested in this case as as Crow Dog. So as you can see that we have a little problem with all these various dogs, be they Low, Long, or Crow.
Shan.

[kingsleybray]

Low Dog footnote: On the 1882 Pine Ridge Ration Roll, the recent transfers from Stending Rock are listed with the notation "North" against their names. Low Dog, ration ticket 1065, with 6 people in his household, has a further notation, which reads "[?] to Cheyenne Ag." This notation is then deleted. The mark indicated by my question mark may be a number. Underneath that notation is another: "2 to 576". The figure of 6 (people, total in household) is then deleted and replaced by 3 - or possibly 5 - quite possibly first by 5, then overwritten to 3. Ephriam might like to compare my reading of this difficult line.

Ticket no. 576 was held by Old Beaver, also notated as "North". The original number of people is written 4, deleted and replaced by 5. The notation "1 from 1065", i.e. from the Low Dog household, is added to the line. To complicate it all again, Old Beaver's name is deleted and replaced by One Man. Possibly this is Isna Wica, Lone Man, one of He Dog's brothers.

Unlike most households noted as "North", that of ticket no. 576 has a number indicating membership in one of the regular agency Oglala bands - in this case, no. 2, referring to Young Man Afraid of His Horse's band, the Payabya.

After writing this I'm not sure whether the confusion created is worth the information imparted!

Kingsley

[tokaouspa]

I think this thread is confused -- bands? I think the word bands is being confused with camps. That is, who was the headman of a camp.

I do know that SB was NOT a wakan, though after he married the Grey Eagle sisters (1871) his status within the Wakans was accepted more by the likes of the more important Wakan members -- Grey Eagle II (Grey Eagle I was killed attacking the Minnesota cavalry when they ventured into the country just east of the missouri near Bismarck, ND), Long Dog, Iron Dog, Rain (all brothers), Bear Soldier, etc.

I can't remember right off, but there were only 3 or 4 distinct "bands." The descendents of these bands can be found at Rock Creek (Bullhead, Wakans), Running Antelope's camp (Little Eagle), and a different one at Wakpala, and another one near Thunder Hawk.