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Post by Walt Cross on Mar 18, 2005 11:08:02 GMT -6
Bigpond; What Kanipe said was that Tom was in command of Co C, which is true, he was the ASSIGNED commander. However, that day he was detached from Co C as Custer's Aide-de-camp leaving Lieuteantnt Harrington in command. Sgt Kanipe was detached that day as an orderly to Custer. Orderlys were trusted soldiers such as Kanipe. It was not unusual to send a sergeant as a messenger. Note that he was trusted with a verbal message, whereas Martin (Martini) was given a written message. That points out two things, the importance of the message and that Martin was not considered as trustworthy as Kanipe. Part of the reason for that was his poor command of the English language.
Walt
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Post by bigpond on Mar 18, 2005 12:06:27 GMT -6
Thanks for that Walt.
He fails to mention this in his story to the Greenboro,N.C.Daily Record April 27th,1924 Page 247 "The Custer Myth" He also fails to mention company "L" Graham 's footnote says,The many inaccuries in Sgt kanipe's story are characteristic of the accounts of most enlisted survivors recounted during the 20's
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Post by Walt Cross on Mar 18, 2005 21:13:33 GMT -6
When you consider that by the 1920s the men were trying to remember things from 40 years ago, its kind of understandable. I came back from Vietnam in 1970 and memories are starting to fade. Good thing I wrote some of it down.
Walt
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Post by Michael Lentz on Mar 22, 2005 13:37:11 GMT -6
For Walt:
I like reading your comments--you know your stuff. Can you answer another question?
In the book "Keep the Last Bullett For Yourself" by Dr. Marquis, he mentions an incident that I always wondered about. On June 26th on Reno Hill, Bentten made a couple of charges to drive back the indians when they got to close to the 7th's lines. On one charge it was stated that a man was in a rifle pit "crying like a child" & didn't go with the rest of the troopers Bentten was leading. It's refered he was "yellow" but was also the best protected, as he was still in the rifle pit. Benteen's men suffered no losses, but when Benteen was returning to his lines this man in the pit was struck in the head & killed. It's made out to sound that he was "excuted" fior his refusal to charge with Benteen. Have you heard of this episode? I have read about this in only a couple of sources & was wondering if this trooper could be one of the 3 they found on Reno hill in the 50's. --- Mike
Also, any source material of what became of young Sturgis & what might of happened to his body?
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Post by crzhrs on Mar 22, 2005 13:52:06 GMT -6
RE: Isiah Dorman
Dorman was well-known to the Sioux, had a Sioux wife, and was called Teat by them. His assignment was as an interpreter . . . if and when any Sioux were captured.
He was wounded during Reno's "charge" and finished off by several Sioux, one woman, Eagle Robe or Her Moving Robe, paid special attention to him. His body was pounded by stone clubs, buckshot to the legs, a iron pin through his genitals, and other "treatment." The Sioux were not happy that he was riding against them and trying to kill people that may have called him friend.
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Post by crzhrs on Mar 22, 2005 14:15:56 GMT -6
RE: "Cowards" on Reno Hill
According to Son of the Morning Star, a soldier by the name of Goldin refused to come out of his rifle pit and when other troopers found him later he was dead . . . a bullit wound to the head. He may or may not have been killed by Indians, but their was speculation that he was "executed" by an irate fellow-soldier.
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Post by tomthebomb on Mar 22, 2005 14:24:32 GMT -6
It seems a little odd that Giovanni Martini (aka John Martin) would be Custer's orderly. Martin could barely speak English, yet he was ordered to find Benteen and get him to Custer ASAP. Cooke, knowing Martin's poor command of English, then wrote the now-famous "Come Quick" message.
When Martin found Benteen, the language gap made it difficult for communication . . . and possibly effect the importance or meaing of what Martin told Benteen, regardless of the written message.
Nothing against him, but I couldn't think of a worse person to send on a vital mission as someone who could hardly speak English.
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Post by Walt Cross on Mar 22, 2005 20:41:28 GMT -6
Michael; This passage from "Harvest of Barren Regrets" may be the incident you are referring to. Benteen was suffering casualties and approached Reno to lead a charge to relieve his company from the sniping.
"Reno led a short charge that that effectively drove away the Indians who were sniping at Benteen's exposed position. One enlisted man was shot in the head and killed, though he seems to have been one of a very few who did not stand up and charge." page 274.
That's all the entry says, its draws no conclusions.
However, Richard G. Hardorff's book "The Custer Battle Casualties" provides the following written by Captain Winfield Edgerly:
"Private Golden, a handsome Irishman in Troop D, behaved very well during the first day's fighting, but after the firing ceased, he went to a veteran sergeant, in whom he had great confidence, and asked him if he thought the Indians would return. The sergeant said they probably would come back at about daylight, upon which Golden commenced to cry. The sergeant asked him what the matter was, and he replied, "Tom, if they come back they will kill me."
The story continues with two men coming back from the Reno charge jumping into the pit with Golden and the narration continues:
"In less than three seconds a bullet came through the crest of the pit, throwing dirt over all of us, and entered the brain of Golden who uttered one groan, pushed with his right foot, and was dead."
This book is a very good source of information regarding Sturgis. His bloody clothing was found in the village but his body never identified.
Walt
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Post by Walt Cross on Mar 22, 2005 20:53:01 GMT -6
To Tom; I seem to remember that Martin/Martini was actually Custer's Trumpeter/Orderly. Sgt Kanipe was his orderly and so was the first man sent with a message. Martin's poor command of English was exactly why Cooke wrote out the message. At the time he wrote the message that was all they knew, it was a big village. No real fighting had yet begun. There wasn't anything else to tell - Big Village, Come Quick, Bring Packs (ammunition and men). Martini could ride and knew the way, he had just come from where Benteen was. I don't really see a problem with them sending Martini. Who, by the way, completed a full miliary career and retired, honorably, as a sergeant. And, if you really think Martini was a less than satisfactory soldier at the time, who else better to send and keep your better soldiers with you?
Walt
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