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Post by noggy on Nov 30, 2021 13:53:58 GMT -6
I have been off boards a few months, have 2 weeks before next deployment, any interesting topics? I take this as a sign you are doing better, which is great to see. It may not tick your box as interesting, but since Fred is coming out with a Valley book I'll post something later on which I really would love to get some input from you and everyone else on. Geir |
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Post by montrose on Nov 30, 2021 19:38:31 GMT -6
Hypothesis. The battle of LBH was lost the moment the main body chose not to support the main body. There is no course of action(COA) that would lead to a win after this decision.
There are plenty of COAs that would lead to better outcomes, up to a draw, or lesser tactical defeats. LTC Custer did not make one bad decision at LBH, he made dozens.
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Post by herosrest on Dec 23, 2021 13:09:58 GMT -6
The matter of and questions over wings are guaranteed to get advocates of 7th Cavalry's senior subordinates into flaps. Companies were assigned to battalions as required and the protocols of seniority could be embroigled into such doingsby senior officers delegating missions. The 7th Cavalry, as a regiment, was operated as two wings of two the company battalions. Administratively, that was how 7th Cavalry operated in 1876. This is a matter wafted into and under the smoke of war because Reno led the right one and Benteen the wrong (left) one. That's how it was and Reno liked it that way. Benteen as well and especially when Custer wasn't around and was then in hot water and sensibly expected never to return to FAL. Once Grant fully vented spleen upon his Lt. Col. Blah blah balh... The newspaper guy, the one AZRanger insists has two markers, Kellogg.... That's it. He reported the expedition as it prepared to leave FAL and in it doesn't get any better (it does) fashion I link to the article www.welchdakotapapers.com/2012/02/col-welch-notes-on-custer/#fort-yates-pioneer- giving the battalion structures and officers. It settles a lot of arguments with people troubled by wings but of course is not enough for the obsessed. 7th Cavalry's monthly officer's return confirm the wings existence and assignments and Billy Markland put them online for all. Hurrah! Custer led the right wing. At LBH. This causes immense arguments because Reno and Benteen were in essence - demoted to battalion commanders. Custer P'd them off. There is more about why the wings were annulled at Rosebud but i'm hungry. Pork & beans. Aaaah the smell of it. Merry Christmas folks. |
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Post by herosrest on Dec 23, 2021 13:38:27 GMT -6
in 1873, Stanley sent Custer with 10 companies of 7th Cavalry in pursuit of Sitting Bull after the deaths of Dr. Honsinger and the expedition sutler whose name, God forbid, I forget.
7th Cavalry were unable to close the running camp before it crossed the Yellowstone (apparently). After spending a day trying to cross the river, 7th Cavalry went into camp and were..... Attacked at dawn by the Sioux.
With that in mind in 1876, Custer annulled the battalions to allow Mathey to assess the best of the companies with packing and herding their pack trains. If there was a hot pursuit, those companies best at running their mules would get the job as lead.
Likewise, Custer was aware he would be attacked if he did not attack. Quite simple stuff really. Attack or be attacked. Hands up if you prefer sitting back and soaking it up.
Very good. Remember, there were only six shovels so, who gets a foxhole ?
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Post by herosrest on Dec 23, 2021 13:44:21 GMT -6
if I remember rightishly, then the missing two companies were I and D led by Reno. That is, Keogh, Weir and Reno on the Canadian border. How did they avoid starting a war?
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Post by noggy on Dec 25, 2021 14:00:13 GMT -6
if I remember rightishly, then the missing two companies were I and D led by Reno. That is, Keogh, Weir and Reno on the Canadian border. How did they avoid starting a war? Hello, HR. I hope you are doing well. Merry Christmas! Noggy |
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Post by herosrest on Dec 27, 2021 17:39:45 GMT -6
God jul.
I'll touch on a fraternity matter which is reflected in military prudence towards events at Little Bighorn. The inquiry into Reno's performance at LBH, requested by himself and signed off by PotUS, brought an unusual strand into study and history of the battle. That was\is military- legal jurisprudence which is a rare and unusual practice. This is not a criticism of said but rather suggestion that it's traditions and history which W.A. Graham proudly opined are a measure of oprobium and its resolution.
Reno did this during his evidence at Chicago. He retreated to Reno Hill in order that the regiment might rally on him.
Opinion is expressed elsewhere that Reno's battalion would have achieved little in advance towards Custer's battleground. This is so as well for Benteen, and the united combat force. Once the rearguard and pack train element were closed up, the combined force was sufficient to hold its own and did so.
I agree that attempting to reach Custer's field of death would have been folly and see no reason to disagree modern thinking on this, although N.A. Miles who earnt his pay fighting this same foe, felt it should have been done. Miles opinion must count, accept it or not, he gives tails to heads - so to speak.
However, there was nothing noble or of bearing about Reno post battle. He misled Terry with regard to the timing of events on Reno Hill and the start of the entrenched fighting.
There was a reason for this and it is salutary. Before setting this out, I will say that I see a very quick and dirty fight which overwhelmed Custer's command in detail. Litterally in detail. et al. Precisely the conclusion arrived at during assessment on 27th and 28th June, 1876.
However, everything understood today gives that conclusion arriving after Benteen joined Reno on the hill.
Both officer's failed specifically to advise Custer where they were. There were some common sense reasons why. That aside, custer, Keogh, Yates and Cooke, were perfectly capable of charging across Deep Coulee to join Reno and Benteen had they known where they were, and what they were doing. Once the 5 companies were losing their horses - they were doomed.
The 5 companies could have been saved with timely concern by Custer's senior subordinates.
The closing point I offer is the United States immense tradition of forlorn hope. It has been remarkable throughout 400 years of consolidating their nation.
Benteen or Reno could have urgently communicated their situation to HQ from Weir's Peak. They did not. When Weir went, the Custer fight was over.
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