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Post by bobbyjo2 on Nov 6, 2021 16:44:22 GMT -6
I still have big problems to understand the strength of the companies in ralation to the overall strength of the regiment. The 7th cavalry starting the campaign with 12 Companies and a overall strength of around 600 men and officers. That should mean a company strength of around 40 to 50 men. How correspond this with the strenght we can count on the battlefield. I don´t count scouts or zivilians and read that Custer had around 205 soldiers with him in his command of 5 companies. That would made a maximum of 40 men each company. Reno himself counts around 100 men in his skirmish line. I guess he meant men without counting officers and so he had around 120 soldiers(?). That would made also a maximum of 40 men each company. I am not sure how many men Benteen had exactly. But from all i have read he had less then 120 men. So i guess he had also a maximum of 40 men each company. Counting these 11 companies together we have a total of around 440 soldiers max. McDougall protect the pack train and he probably had a maximum of 50(more likely 40)soldiers in his company. I read that the pack train made around 127 men. Reno said he had around 400 men under command on the Reno/Benteen hill. It seems that a lot of soldiers, up to 127 possibly?, came with the packs. I know in the company strenght of the 7th cavalry were counted normaly 4 support men(2 farriers & blacksmiths, 1 each saddler and wagoner), but i guess as the whole companies(regiment) was hard understrenght that it was the same with the support men? If those men had ideal strenght(what i doubt) then with the packs came 24 farriers & blacksmiths, 12 saddler and 12 wagoner = 48 men. There would be still a problem with 70 to 80 men without command. Is there an error in my summation? Can i btw read somewhere exactly how many men were with Reno and how many with Benteen?
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Post by Yan Taylor on Nov 7, 2021 6:55:16 GMT -6
A: 41 B: 45 C: 38 D: 45 E: 38 F: 38 G: 35 H: 39 I: 40 K: 32 L: 46 M: 46 (48?) RHQ: 10 (not inc civies)
I have the totals for the pack train somewhere, I will try and find them later, but there is around 90 if I can remember.
Ian
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Post by bobbyjo2 on Nov 9, 2021 11:14:59 GMT -6
I still have big problems to understand the strength of the companies in ralation to the overall strength of the regiment. Can this be read? Ulan, If you cannot down-load this file, let me know. It is in Excel format and I can e-mail it to you if you want. It will give you a complete breakdown of where every man was on June 25th. Failing all that, you would have to buy my book to see the chart. Best wishes, Fred.
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Post by fred on Nov 9, 2021 19:02:20 GMT -6
Custer crossed the divide with 607 officers and men. If you add in all the sundries, i.e., scouts, interpreters, civilians, the total at the Little Big Horn is 655 men.
Battle strength for the regiment (military personnel, only), i.e., after all stragglers, messengers, attachments, detachments, etc., are provided for, is as follows:
Regimental headquarters: 9 officers and men. Company A-- 2 officers, 39 enlisted men Company B-- 1 officer, 42 men Company C-- 1 officer, 36 men Company D-- 2 officers, 43 men Company E-- 2 officers, 36 men Company F-- 2 officers, 36 men Company G-- 2 officers, 35 men Company H-- 2 officers, 38 men Company I-- 2 officers, 36 men Company K-- 1 officer, 31 men Company L-- 2 officers, 44 men Company M-- 1 officer, 46 men
Reno's headquarters contingent consisted of 4 officers, 8 enlisted men. The four officers were Varnum, Hare, Hodgson, and Reno. The enlisted personnel were : Strode (A); Abbotts & Pendtle (E); Davern (F); Penwell & Clear (K); Mask (B), and Trumble (B).
The pack train, including Company B as its rear guard, consisted of 2 officers, 140 men.
Best wishes, Fred.
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Post by Yan Taylor on Nov 10, 2021 15:00:15 GMT -6
I am out a tad on B, C, G, H, & I.
There is always a grey area concerning B, some say that they had no trooper packers because they were the escourt, but their six company mules needed packers and seeing that every company provided half a dozen or so, I would guess that B did too.
Ian
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Post by fred on Nov 13, 2021 5:12:28 GMT -6
Ian,
You are absolutely correct about Company B and the packs. McDougall's command had its packers, as well, but since they all rode together, I do not distinguish or subtract B's packers from its battle strength. There some evidence the following men were part of that Company B pack contingent, one for sure:
PVT Campbell, Charles A. – Possibly assigned to pack train as a packer on June 25.
PVT Carey, John J. (aka, Casey, Carry, and Cory)— Possibly assigned to pack train as a packer on June 25.
PVT DeVoto, Augustus Louis— Told Walter Camp he had been a packer with the pack train on June 25.
PVT Stowers, Thomas James (aka, James Thomas)— Possibly assigned to pack train as a packer on June 25.
Hope you, Susan, the boys, and everyone are doing well. Give Susan a hug from me, will you?
Best wishes, Fred.
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Post by Yan Taylor on Nov 13, 2021 13:39:03 GMT -6
Thanks Fred, I have been hoping to catch you to ask you about the lastest BLBH documentary, by trailers look great, is it out soon? Yes, B must have had a detail acting as trooper packers, you have done well nailing those four, I have never seen any names before from other souces, so good job.
Hope you and Lisa are okay and have had your covid jabs.
Ian
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Post by fred on Nov 19, 2021 8:00:30 GMT -6
Ian,
The day-by-day book should be out shortly: maybe next month, January at the latest it seems. It is a reference book, not a narrative in the traditional sense. I refer to it as a "bullet narrative."
Working on one more, but it is not finished yet, so that one will have a long lead time. After that, if health holds up and COVID dies the death we all wish for it, I will have one more, co-authored with a good man, all about the markers.
After that I shall fade into oblivion, not soon enough for some I would guess.
Best wishes, Fred.
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Post by Yan Taylor on Nov 19, 2021 14:14:18 GMT -6
Yeah that Covid killed my Brother four days ago, horrible virus.
Once your work is out there Fred, you don't just fade away, it lives forever, look a John Grey, his book is still in print and still selling. This topic will always be here and as such, books on the subject will continue to be read.
Ian
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Post by fred on Nov 21, 2021 6:44:43 GMT -6
Ian,
I am terribly sorry to hear about your brother. That is awful and you have my very best wishes for yourself and the rest of your family.
We have been exceptionally cautious here; I have already had my third, or booster shot (back in early September), and my wife got hers Friday. Her reaction was a bit more severe than mine (simple exhaustion for a day and a half), but after breaking out in severe sweats last night, she seems much better and less aching this morning. We can only imagine how bad the "real" thing must be.
Anyway, please take care, all of you.
Very best wishes, Fred.
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Post by fred on Nov 21, 2021 6:51:47 GMT -6
Thanks Fred, I have been hoping to catch you to ask you about the lastest BLBH documentary, by trailers look great, is it out soon? Ian, Sorry, I missed this. The Great Sioux Campaign, 1876, Day-By-Day seems like it will be released quite soon, maybe even sooner than I anticipated. I got an email from the president of the publishing house saying they are doing the "final pass." She said they were quite pleased with how the manuscript looked, so I imagine sooner rather than later. You may enjoy this one: it is more of a reference work than a narrative-- which it clearly is not. The work is a synthesis of many other historians, writers, authors, etc., with a lot of archival data included, viz., letters, telegrams, etc. Anyway, if you get it, I hope you enjoy it. Best wishes, Fred.
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Post by Yan Taylor on Nov 21, 2021 13:42:27 GMT -6
Thank you Fred, yes he caught it in hospital.
It is great to see you still busy and adding to your canon of books, perhaps I may meet you one day on the battlefield, along with AZ and Tom.
Ian
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