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Post by ephriam on Jan 3, 2006 20:17:06 GMT -6
Fred mentioned in a different thread the eye-witness account of Thomas Disputed. Thought I would post what little information we have about him.
Thomas Disputed was interviewed by Walter Camp, perhaps around 1910-11. The interview was published in Bruce R. Liddic and Paul Harbaugh (eds.), Camp on Custer (Spokane, WA: A. H. Clark Co., 1995; reprinted as Custer and Company, Walter Camp's Notes on the Custer Fight, Lincoln: University of Nebraska Press, 1998), p. 121-127.
Thomas Disputed was born about 1854-55 (though a couple of the census records put his birth at about 1858). In his notes, Camp noted that Thomas was Oglala, belonging to Big Road's band, which would put him in the Oyuhpe Oglala. He was in Crazy Horse's village in March 1876 when Crook struck the Northern Cheyenne village further south, and was in the Rosebud and LBH fights. From his account, it appears that he surrendered at the Red Cloud Agency in May 1877 with Crazy Horse, though his name (he said he was known as Shave Elk in 1876) does not appear in the Crazy Horse Surrender Ledger. Presumably he then left with Big Road when the northern Oglala fled the agency in late 1877 and early 1878, eventually making their way to Canada.
There is no record of Shave Elk/Thomas Disputing for the next ten years. If he surrendered with Big Road and was transferred to the Standing Rock Agency in 1881, he must have given a different name, for neither of these appear in the Sitting Bull Surrender Census or in the Standing Rock Agency issue and annuity records for the period.
My first record of him is in 1887 when he suddenly appears at the Standing Rock Agency, having just married the daughter of chief Gall. He appears in the annual census each year after that through 1911. He disappears in the 1912 census, suggesting that he may have passed away between late 1911 and early 1912.
Camp somewhat garbled Thomas Disputed's Lakota names. Shave Elk should be Hehaka Tasla (Hehaka = the male elk; sla = bald, bare; I am not certain what "ta" means, there are several possible meanings). The Lakota name translated as Disputed was Akinica, meaning "to dispute about something, claiming it as one's own".
Please let me know if anyone has additional information on him. Thanks.
Ephriam
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Post by fred on Jan 4, 2006 5:15:03 GMT -6
Ephriam--
Thanks!!! This adds a lot to the little I have. What I DO have on a lot of these men is merely names, MOST of which I have gotten from the LBHA boards (I suspect those names have come from your pen). Right now, the "names" total close to 900. In your discussions w/ Kingleys Bray & glenbow, you mention the census taken in Jul85 at the Standing Rock Agency. You even provide a Website address. I went on that site & printed out the census. Now my question becomes, how many of those names in that census were at the village on 25Jun76? Is there any way to determined that?
Ephriam, I hate to be nothing but a taker here, but I have no idea how to contribute to your work, especially living in Florida. If you can come up w/ an answer to that quandary, I would certainly be willing to help you in your endeavors.
Again, thanks, & best wishes, Fred.
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Post by ephriam on Jan 4, 2006 7:42:32 GMT -6
Fred:
The document that you viewed on-line from July 1885 is an annuity list, created for the issue of annuity goods (clothing, farming equipment, etc.) at the Standing Rock Agency. This is seperate from the actual census records which lists each family and each member within that family. For the year 1885, we have two annuity lists (July and Dec. 1885), many ration issue lists (there is one for every two weeks for issue of flour, beef, etc. for the entire year), and we have one actual census.
To create a list of who participated in the Great Sioux War of 1876-77 (and the LBH), I have been creating a database of all the names from 1877 (the year these documents begin) all the way through 1891, just after Wounded Knee. I have recently been expanding the database through 1910 to get to the period when land was allotted to individual Lakota since most of the bands settled together (most reservation communities have their origin as one of the original Lakota bands). I have been doing this for each of the reservations where LBH participants ended up at (Standing Rock, Pine Ridge, Cheyenne River, Northern Cheyenne, etc.).
This allows you to track individuals over time through the different bands. Since we have a fairly good idea of which bands were away from the agency in 1876, we can create a good estimate of how many were probably at the LBH and even list most of them by name, including husbands, wives and children.
One of the most critical documents for this work is the Sitting Bull Surrender Census which I am working up for publication right now. It was created in Aug.-Sept. 1881 just as the recently returned "hostiles" from Canada were being turned over by the military to the Indian Office officials at Standing Rock. This census is absolutely amazing. Not only does it list every person by name (both English and Lakota), their age and relationships within the family, the census taker also asked questions such as "how long have you been at the agency" and "how many deer and buffalo have you killed" during the past year. A total of 1081 families, or 4293 people. Great stuff! The only thing I wish they had done better was to have listed everyone by the band they belonged to; in this census many bands are lumped together. Fortunately, Agent McLaughlin did a much better job three months later in Dec. 1881 in his annual annuity list to list everyone under a specific chief. During this period, annuity goods were given to the headman who then distributed to his followers, one way in which their leadership position was strengthened.
In the Sitting Bull Census, the agency bands are listed seperate from those who had just arrived from Canada with Sitting Bull. I would suspect that most, if not all, of those surrendering with Sitting Bull were at the LBH. In this census, the northern bands are listed as:
Hunkpapa: Sitting Bull and Four Horns, 41 families, 195 people Crow King, 63 families, 285 people Gall, 52 families, 229 people Rain in the Face, 39 families, 179 people
Blackfeet: Crawler, 23 families, 179 people
Minneconjou/Sans Arc: Fool Heart, 26 families, 112 people Circle Bear, 85 families, 351 people Hump, 142 families, 714 people
Oglala: Big Road, 13 families, 47 people Low Dog, 82 families, 386 people
Brule: Bull Dog, 41 families, 206 people
This includes everyone who were transferred to Standing Rock from either Fort Buford or Fort Keogh -- except for one band, that of Spotted Eagle (36 families/139 people) who was transferred to the Cheyenne River Agency just before the census was taken. I found an issue record from Cheyenne River from the time of the transfer, so have now been able to assign names of the heads of families for this band, though not their wives and children. (We do not get that for Cheyenne River until 1886.)
A long-winded answer to your initial question! Take a look at your copy of the July 1885 annuity list; notice that the Hunkpapa are divided into bands, under which each family is listed. The first section are all the agency bands, starting with Thunder Hawk, Broken Bear Rib, through Running Antelope. Then, the bands starting with High Bear forward through Bear Looking Back are all "northern" bands. Most of those were transferred to Standing Rock in 1881 with Sitting Bull. A few such as No Neck's band were those who left Canada later -- I think No Neck came in 1884. There were some transfers between bands during these years, but I would suspect that most of the people listed in these northern bands were at the LBH.
Hope that helps!
Ephriam
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Post by fred on Jan 5, 2006 13:55:12 GMT -6
Ephriam--
It helps immensely! Now what can I do to help you? I am intent upon gathering the names of as many people as I can from that village. Can you imagine the implications on the story of that battle if you can more accurately pinpoint the number of people who were involved? To me, it's almost staggering & it has never even been closely attempted.
Do I have to move to Utah?
Best wishes, Fred.
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jjm
Junior Member
Posts: 70
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Post by jjm on Jan 5, 2006 16:37:49 GMT -6
Ephriam
Have you finished your book on the photographs of D S Mitchell? It was him and not Hamilton, wasn't it?
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Post by ephriam on Jan 5, 2006 19:29:28 GMT -6
Fred:
No, you do not need to move to Utah. I would love to have help entering names into the master database, and I can provide digitized copies of census records if you are up to it! I would be very excited to have some help. You can send me an email off this thread at ephriam3@yahoo.com.
Jjm:
Yes, I am finishing up my manuscript on the D. S. Mitchell Lakota and Arapahoe portraits from the Red Cloud Agency, in 1877. I promised to have it ready for the reviewers by the end of this month, but the publisher said it will take about a year before it will be available in print. I have also been doing some work on James H. Hamilton; in fact, I finally located living family members and now have a portrait of the photographer along with other information that links him to his brother, C. L. Hamilton, the photographer who produced some great Indian photographs at Fort Randall during the Civil War. And finally, if you are interested in photographs from this period, my article on Private Charles Howard and his photographs from 1877 (including the famous image of the 2nd Cavalry encampment near Fort Fetterman, usually incorrectly dated as 1876) is coming out in this current issue of Annals of Wyoming, just in the mail to subscribers this week.
Thanks for asking!
Ephriam
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eamonn
Full Member
debates are brilliant as they bring us together despite our differences
Posts: 156
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Post by eamonn on Feb 23, 2011 7:13:55 GMT -6
Fred/Ephriam
I note with interest your discussions dating back to January 2006 which relates to idendities of families, warriors & headmen present at LBH. Did you ever manage to successfully identify the names/stats, I would be mightly impressed if you did. Is there any information available?
Respectfully yours
Eamonn
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Post by fred on Feb 23, 2011 8:58:44 GMT -6
I note with interest your discussions dating back to January 2006 which relates to idendities of families, warriors & headmen present at LBH. Did you ever manage to successfully identify the names/stats, I would be mightly impressed if you did. Is there any information available? Eamonn, At the risk of seeming too self-consumed, if you go to this Website: www.mcfarlandpub.com/... then to "History," then click on "United States (American West)," and scroll down to near the end of the page, you will see a book titled Participants in the Battle of the Little Big Horn. If you click on that you will get a brief discussion of that particular book. That is my contribution-- currently-- to what I think you are seeking. Remember that a good deal of that data on the Indians at the LBH-- almost 1,500 names-- is from Ephriam and I credit him as the major contributor to that section. I suspect that as time goes on-- and knowing my penchant for never finishing anything-- there will be more to add. That book, however, will give anyone more collated data than they will ever be able to get anywhere else. At least as of today. Of that I am sure. If there is anything else you would like about that kind of thing, just e-mail me or send me a PM. Best wishes, Fred.
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