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Post by Tom Trevor on Jul 17, 2005 20:24:22 GMT -6
And much to my surprise I learned the buffalo hunting stopped in 1874 and after that you could not even give the hides away. So much for all the books I have read.
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Post by elisabeth on Jul 18, 2005 2:43:02 GMT -6
Oh, I can't wait for this thing to get to the UK! Sounds hilarious.
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Post by crzhrs on Jul 19, 2005 13:40:09 GMT -6
Tom T:
There was major buffalo hunting continuing on the Southern Plains. That was one of the reasons the Comanche and Kiowa took up arms during the 1874 Red River War (aka The Buffalo War). There were still plenty of buffalo to kill in Kansas with millions dying for their hides.
The Sioux and Cheyenne were still strong on the Northern Plains and prevented all but the best-armed and supplied whites from roaming about.
It wasn't until the Gold Rush in the Black Hills that resulted in thousands of whites over-running the hills, which violated the Sioux Treaty of 1868, and which the military was to suppose keep out.
It wasn't until the late 1870s that the buffalo was virtually gone. Once there were over 40 million, but the late 1800s less than 100!
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Post by Keith Wamer on Aug 1, 2005 12:42:59 GMT -6
>:(I agree with what most have said, what a letdown by Mr. Speildberg! I waited all summer to see what a master filmmaker would do with one of Amercian history's most dramatic events and he really flopped! About 20 men on last stand hill? Very dry geography in a place the Indians called the Greasy Grass, no Indian dead, a pretty boy Crazy Horse who looked liked he should be on Amercian Idol instead of Montana. Where do I begin to vent my frustration? The Sioux were in Crow territory, Custer wore a black hat because he was a bad guy, no mention of the mutilated troopers, no look at the Reno fight or Benteen's betrayal either. The entire Little Big Horn scence took about 3 minutes? Speildberg better stay with alien invasions next summer and leave the American west to someone who knows what is up.
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Post by crzhrs on Aug 1, 2005 13:40:37 GMT -6
We can all say the same except it was the Indians, who for years were shown as only mono-syllable savages, killing, raping, scalping, mutilating, and torturing every white they could find . . . according to earlier Hollywood and TV shows.
Watch F TROOP . . . everyone gets made fun of! That way no one can complain.
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Post by michigander1 on Aug 1, 2005 17:09:21 GMT -6
But now it's more than a half century that indians are presented like angels with no blame. Generally, they present a peacefull tribe with only one bad indian, that provoke the unfair white man. Look "Tonka", where a livid Custer says to a surprised Keogh: "Let us go there, I want kill them all". The sixties used indians for their political tasks, this I will never stop to tell it. They was used in a more unfair manner. As also DeLoria Vine admitted. He also condemned that way of white to look at indians almost like if they "was a protected race. There is not a indian problem. We must solve our problems" I hope now movies will be more balanced. I was waiting for Oliver Stone's movie but he had to stop it cause the Primadonna Brad Pitt (interpreting Custer) left the stage to goes work on another movie...mmmmh, much professional
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bhist
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Post by bhist on Aug 1, 2005 21:54:35 GMT -6
I hope now movies will be more balanced. I was waiting for Oliver Stone's movie but he had to stop it cause the Primadonna Brad Pitt (interpreting Custer) left the stage to goes work on another movie...mmmmh, much professional I just can't believe what some people post on this board. The Stone movie never broke ground. Everything you state here is completely untrue. Get your facts straight before you post please.
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Post by El Crab on Aug 2, 2005 1:49:40 GMT -6
Pitt and Stone both walked and the script was apparently terrible, which I believe was the main reason they jumped ship. And even if they somehow had salvaged the script, it would have been inaccurate. I read a script review, and it had Custer becoming more and more sympathetic to the Indians (sort of true), growing his hair out and wearing buckskins, turning Indian himself and it leading to an inner struggle. So any hope of an accurate Custer is out the window, and thankfully the project fell through years ago.
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Post by elisabeth on Aug 2, 2005 3:58:18 GMT -6
Sounds just awful.
I read a rumour a while back that Stone still had plans to tackle the subject, but basing it on the Chiaventone book instead of 'Marching to Valhalla' (which I believe was the starting-point for the fiasco version). But if there really is a remake of SOTMS in the works, maybe this won't happen either ...
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Post by michigander1 on Aug 2, 2005 5:46:54 GMT -6
Bhist Then what, arrogance is a part of your behaviour?. I just posted what all the newspapers write here. If isn't true I'm happy about. Crab gave the same answer without to be arrogant. And, as the facts are like Crab described, really better the movie was not achieved. However, all the internet references says that Pitt left the movie BEFORE. So Bhist, even if you are the president of your association, you don't are omniscient. www.cinematter.com/movie.php3?marchingtovalhallawww.corona.bc.ca/films/directorscut/971204.htmlSo, Bhist, things are not clear as they seems
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Post by michigander1 on Aug 2, 2005 5:50:25 GMT -6
The some people posting is Lorenzo Gabanizza. Now you know my real name. And I think you are not gentle to refer to me as "some people" as you wasn't gentle in passed matters and I tryed to explain to you.
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Post by crzhrs on Aug 2, 2005 17:50:47 GMT -6
It appears we have a world-wide discussion here. People from the US, France, Italy. Ain't the Internet great?
Or . . . are we all really lonely people with nothing better to do than sit in front of a computer and talk to total strangers.
Only foolin' folks . . . I have a great life and spend very little of it on the computer. But I do enjoy discussing Custer/LBH/Indians with people who have the same interest. Hard to find people in my area to discuss this stuff with.
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bhist
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Post by bhist on Aug 2, 2005 21:07:33 GMT -6
Michael Blake and I were in touch with each other when he was writing the script from his book, “Marching…”. He had a big change of heart about Custer. He told me he hated Custer when writing "Dances with Wolves" but over the years realized Custer was far more complex and not so easy to like or dislike.
So, he wrote, "Marching..." with a favorable view of Custer. Problem was his book was really boring. I made myself finish it.
Blake ended-up pocketing $1M for his finished script (if it wasn't for him winning the Oscar for his script of "Dances" I don't think he would have been able to find a publisher for "Marching...").
Problem with his story is it ends the morning of the battle with no battle described. So, the producers decided they would add the battle to the film. They were at that level of pre-production when the whole thing fell through. Blake walked away with $1M instead of $3M since the film was never produced.
As I mentioned in another post, a new film about LBH is going to be made. Don't know yet who's behind it, but a friend of mine gave the producer a tour. Once I find out, and if I can share info, I'll definitely let you all know. But, I'm sure it's not Stone -- I hope not, at least.
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Post by Diane Merkel on Aug 2, 2005 21:21:17 GMT -6
The only new feature film I am aware of is a remake of Son of the Morning Star: chud.com/news/1750
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bhist
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Post by bhist on Aug 2, 2005 23:08:59 GMT -6
Then, my guess is that the producers of this remake are who were given the tour. I did check your link, Diane, and the article mentions Mount Films is producing it. This is really scary -- go to mountfilms.com and see what you get.
If these producers are one and the same, then we have the chance that this new "Custer" film is going to be a grade Z movie with a very low budget. Remember the great Indian village in the classic Twilight Zone episode -- I think there were five maybe six tipis representing the entire village?!
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