shawn
Junior Member
My sons and I...Reno Hill June 26th 2006
Posts: 98
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Post by shawn on Jan 28, 2006 19:44:22 GMT -6
Ruth Bebe Hill wrote this book and I havent been able to find it. I guess she researched for something like 40 yrs...smooth reading.
Has anyone else read this?
Have a great day
Shawn
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Post by alfuso on Jan 28, 2006 22:46:01 GMT -6
I read this book decades ago. Interesting histories/myths but it's a difficult read in that it just didn't seem to flow for me. I felt like I was wading through molassas.
alfuso
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Post by crzhrs on Jan 29, 2006 14:04:02 GMT -6
I believe the book was bashed by Native Americans . . . I forget why, though
There was also a movie made based on the book . . . it sucked! (Oops, sorry!)
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Post by alfuso on Jan 29, 2006 16:42:33 GMT -6
I reacall NA's bashed the book because they didn't like the way some "sacred" ceremonies were conducted and the hints of homosexuality in them.
And yes, the TV movie was gosh-awful.
alfuso
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Post by grahamew on Jan 31, 2006 11:12:25 GMT -6
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Post by markland on Jan 31, 2006 11:42:43 GMT -6
Graham, thanks for that link. Deloria's review was great. I particularly loved this phrase:
"The Smithsonian article notes that Chunksa Yuha vomited a lot and this characteristic is easy to understand if one has followed the reasoning process used to authenticate the book."
Best of wishes,
Billy
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Post by Jim on Jan 31, 2006 11:47:44 GMT -6
Hope it doesn't make Oprah's Book Club!?!?!?
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Post by crzhrs on Jan 31, 2006 12:06:57 GMT -6
Apparently ASAIL didn't think much of the book . . . to put it mildly.
I agree with some when Native Americans are depicted so PC that it is utterly ridiculous to even consider it the truth . . . they were not loving angels, but they were not the boogey man, either.
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Post by elisabeth on Jan 31, 2006 12:08:35 GMT -6
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Post by crzhrs on Jan 31, 2006 12:22:56 GMT -6
Elisabeth:
Just read the "in love" piece . . . quite eye-opening. But the SB-McLaughling feud comes through once again. SB was very slow to give up his traditional way of live and McLaughlin faults him for it as a "bad" Indian.
If only the whites didn't push Indians to give up their culture so quickly and let them transition slowly or keep some of their old ways.
I guess the decades of warfare frightened whites that unless you kill the "Indian" and save the person nothing would change.
The "Indian" was killed but the person was not saved from falling into never-never-land (Never Indian-Never White)
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Post by elisabeth on Jan 31, 2006 12:30:36 GMT -6
Yes, McLaughlin loathed Sitting Bull. I get the impression it's because SB was cleverer than him, and McL could never get around him. Always one step ahead.
But yes, that's very true; the whites must have thought they were doing the right thing in imposing their values -- "saving souls" etc., and finding a way of not killing Indians -- but a phased transition would have been so much better. A voluntary one even more so, of course, but that's dreamland.
Same drama over polygamy with the Mormons, come to think of it.
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Post by shatonska on Jan 31, 2006 16:53:39 GMT -6
incredibly i found this book in italy and saw the tvmovie too , the book is the story of the origin of the oglalas , just after having passed the missouri river , you can find real figures like old smoke , bull bear and the birth of red cloud too , history and romance , i like the book , a bit difficult to read but if you already know the story of the oglalas is simpler to understand , the tvmovie is a too short summary to be organic but not so bad
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Post by teleri on Oct 2, 2011 8:07:12 GMT -6
I read this book many years ago, with no preconceptions or expectations, etc. Just found it in some old bin. I found it totally captivating. It opened up an incredible world, mysterious yet natural, which is one of the themes that runs throughout. Frankly I don't care if it's totally fiction (which I don't believe it is), only that it moved me in a powerful way. I only recently learned of the intense objections to it by certain individuals, Native American and others. I have to say that, after reading many of the comments against it, my conclusion is that many of the objections are largely misplaced and there was something going on there that doesn't ring true, ulterior motives. This is just my personal, gut feeling of course, I claim no expert knowledge of it. But reading the book I found absolutely nothing demeaning to the Lakota or any other tribe. Nor is is some fluffy, nice-Indian fairytale, as some of those who attacked it insisted. I truly am baffled by the reaction. So I suspect many hidden motives on the part of the detractors. Of course as often happens one or two people, perhaps widely respected, take an opposing stand (again, with unclear motives and goals) and then a great number of people follow suit, many never read the book but jump on the bandwagon, so to speak. I have found myself doing this to a degree in past without realizing it, so I'm not being self-righteous, it's just something that happens, especially when so much truly has been written, filmed, etc, depicting Native Americans so negatively, falsely, every way but honestly. In this case, many Native Americans defended the book as well, so it really becomes a subjective thing. It may be that some of the charges of false identity among th books advisors are true, or it may not. It may be true that the motives of the main detractors are driven by desire for financial gain, or by desire to control any and all historical perspectives, or it may not. There are countless instances of disagreement of this kind just between various tribes and/or factions within a single people. So for me all that counts is the impact the work itself has on me when I experience it... and for me Hanta Yo is moving and transcends this world of conflicting opinion and perspective, of imagined or real objection. Other than that, I will say that the book and the author deserve more than the cursory shout-down based on the opinions of others, no matter who they are. If one dislikes this book after reading it with open mind (and heart) then so be it. For me, it is neither history nor fiction; to judge it on historical grounds is missing the point. For me it's a work of art by an author that devoted half her life to bringing it into being. It lifted my spirits into another realm... and cleared the way.
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Post by lilsandbay on Oct 2, 2011 17:26:33 GMT -6
teleri: I hate to inform you that the novel by Hill was a scam all the way! She claimed she was guided by a Dakota person for twenty years, he was a live in guest at her home during that time. His "Indian" name was Chunska Yuha and as a very small child he was kept away pourposly from White people until age thirteen by the tribal elders and taught in an ancient dialect, long supress trribal secrets and rites which he passed on to Ruth Beebe Hill. This knowledge makes up the base of her novel. This is knowledge was supposedly kept from white people as well as Dakota people. HOGWASH! I bumped into ths issue by reading a copy of Smithsonian magazine. I showed the mag. to my Mother, which included a picture of "Chunka Yuha". My Mom said,... Holy Crap! thats Uncle Lorenzo!!! By way of digression, at that time my Mom had a Masters in Education; and I was the Executive Director of the Minnesota Indian Affairs Intertribal Board, my Board being the eleven Tribal Chairmen of the tribes on Minnesota. I contacted the Nat'l Archives (pre http://WWW.com) and they sent back to my office Lorenzos Genoa school records. You have to understand that Hill waqs a personal friend of Ayn Rand and he novel depicts and glorifies the individual. There is not a Dakota, Nakota, Lakota who doesn't understand that our culture was rich and complex because it was not possible to exist as the out there alone rugged individual. Again eluding to an earlier post... its also why homosexuality was a no harm no foul issue, survival is hard and you cannot simply throw away conrtibuting members of the society. I guess I'm the one who got the ball rolling so many years ago on HANTO YO, but just like Dark Cloud who will stand up an tell us that the Emperor is naked... this is my time. Feel free to send me a personal message if you need much more information
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wayne
New Member
Posts: 2
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Post by wayne on Jun 12, 2012 15:47:17 GMT -6
hi, Hanta Yo is my bible...a tough read the first time, its a different way of interpreting the information we are given, the idea of choice, the freedom to believe whatsoever we wish...learning to learn from the lessons of the land, the water, the sky, from those who have gone on before and thought about these things along the way, the grandfathers...its about community
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