Burial of Crazy Horse

[clw]

And were there any taboos regarding the speaking of the name of someone who had died?

This is more easily understood if it's called a courtesy than a taboo. Those who pass on can be called on spiritually in a time of need, but in doing so one keeps them near. Better for them to be allowed to move on along the spirit road.

[crzhrs]

Also bringing up the names brings back the grief.

[brock]

What clw and crzhrs said is a better way to say it. Taboo is a poor word and I probably should have caught it initially...but I didn't. Apologies.

[clw]

Well three heads are always better than one! Especially if one is yours, Brock. You've shared some special things with us.

[Melani]

Thanks, guys. Didn't know what other word to use.

[HinTamaheca]

There are only a handful of elders on Pine Ridge that know the real location of the remains of Crazy Horse, and they are not about to tell anyone. When they have all died, no one will know.

Let it go.

[clw]

Hin~

I thought we had, since the last post on this topic was two months ago and that concensus was pretty much reached. But since you brought it up again -- the elders who know where he lies would be surprised to learn they all live on Pine Ridge.

Your friend,
Sadee

["Hunk" Papa]

Mar 20, 2008 16:18:14 GMT -6 bc said:

I'm just wondering, if anyone knows, just how did Indian culture in those days treat their burial sites?

bc, there is a book by Dr. H.C. Yarrow "North American Indian Burial Customs" that gives a lot of information on the subject, but not limited to the Plains Indians. I have no idea if it is still available, but it might be worth a shot.

Hunk

[kiktayokangi]

aho! just discovered these boards. very interesting group of people! lots of good information and viewpoints.

my grandpa is full blood oglala elder in Porcupine on the rez. His grandfather was Sinte, who lived and rode with Crazy Horse. He is on the surrender ledgers too. Chips was in charge of CH's burial sites...they moved his remains several times. Beaver Creek (near Spotted Tail Agency) in Nebraska was the first burial spot. It is ok I say this as it is no longer there. I can say that his bones now lie between wounded knee and manderson but the exact spot will never be known to outsiders.

"it does not matter where his body lies; there the grass is growing. But where his Spirit is, that would be a good place to be."
---Black Elk

[biggordie]

kiktayokangi:

Most of the discussions and discussers from this forum will be found on the new forum at www. American-Tribes.com. You might want to check it out and become a member. You will be welcomed with open arms.

Gordie

[kiktayokangi]

thank you. I signed up this morning but have not posted yet. looks very good!

[bc]

Crazy Horse photo.

Just wondering if anyone else watched the History Detectives on PBS last night where they checked whether a photo of CH was authentic? They decided it wasn't but I'm not sure they carried their investigation far enough into this Stabber character or Dewey Beard or this B.B.E.

A guy from South Dakota had an old photo that was pawned alleged to be Crazy Horse. It had a note written on the back of the frame in the ancient old Lakota language around 1900. Took it to a professor at the Lakota college in SD. He translated it and said it was by Dewey Beard who was at the battle when he was 10 years old and that Beard knew Crazy Horse which the professor believed to be true. Beard said it was an authentic photo of CH. The professor indicated that Beard dictated it to another Lakota who did the writing and signed it with the initials: B. B. E. No investigation was done as to the identity of B.B.E. The professor didn't think it was CH because the photo had a single eagle feather and he said CH only wore the feathers of a red tailed hawk and that CH had light hair and was light complected. You couldn't see enough of his left cheek to see of there was a scar there or not although Dewey Beard said in writing that he could see the scar.

They went to the Smithsonian where a guy identified the photo as an authentic photo of the period and that the date of 1875 on the back with the photographer name of Alex Gardiner and his address of 942 Penn Ave. in DC made it a Gardiner print. That the date of 1875 was probable as there were a number of NA delegations that came to Washington including Red Cloud in 1875. It was not likely taken when Gardiner was at Fort Laramie in 1868.

They also went to the CH memorial in SD and talked to CH's grandson. He said there were 3 lines of grandfather, father, and son all named Crazy horse and showed a drawing of CH's father also named CH. He then showed a police sketch artist's drawing about 60 years later in the 1930's for CH's sister. He said CH's sister cried when it was done and said that was him. The detective in the story didn't attach much credibility to a 60 year old police artist sketch.

Another lady at the Smithsonian found a book of glass photo plates by Gardiner and that same picture showed up labeled as an NA named Stabber. I forget the Lokota name that was listed on the photo. That ended the investigation declaring the photo a fraud as no one states that CH ever went to Washington. They did not do a follow up investigation regarding Stabber and why Gardiner labeled his photo as CH or whether maybe CH went to DC incognito.

To me the story left more questions than answers. The Lakota professor didn't seem to interested in opening up any can of worms as he repeated CH's story of the photo capturing his soul and he may have a vested interest in not seeing CH's soul captured.

Found this: 9) "Stabber -- Vua- sha-peh." Gardner's book of photos is on sale for $120K. However the Red Cloud group was in the capital in 1872.


bc

[crzhrs]

I saw the show. The date of the photo was 1875. We know CH did not come in to a reservation until 1877 and he never attended any meetings with Whites, signed treaties or lived on reservations until his surrender.

As soon as I saw the 1875 date I knew the photo was not of CH.

Stabber's "Indian Name" was no where close to CH's Indian name.

That was not a photo of Crazy Horse.

[Dark Cloud]

"...the ancient old Lakota language around 1900." Which had no writing till schools gave them an alphabet and their first concept of an alphabet. How in the world would anyone know if this represented the language in the years relevant, in any case well before 1900 to be "ancient old?"

When was Dewey Beard asked to ID the photo? And how old was he? And this is believed why? And who was there when DB gave the ID to an unknown 3rd party for 'proof?'

That it was being pawned means the value had to be inflated. History Channel Away!

[wolfgang911]

well if dewey beard can't identify crazy horse what are we doing here, history sucks!