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Post by George Armstrong Custer on May 29, 2006 23:53:52 GMT -6
Leyton, your comparison between Michaelangelo's David and Donatello's is a good one in respect of comparing the West Point Custer statue to more martial ones. In Donatello's defense, however, it should be noted that he also produced the famous equestrian bronze statue at Padua of the 15th-century Condottieri [mercenary] captain, Il Gattamelata [the Honeyed Cat]. The ruthless and purposeful power of these freebooters is perfectly captured in what is widely regarded as the first great bronze of the Rennaissance: If I recall correctly, the head and shoulders of the West Point Custer was removed to make a bust, though everything of it has now disappeared. Could it still be in the corner of some cellar at the Point............Horrendous a depiction of Custer though it is, it deserves preservation as it has become an integral part of the Custer story, so well documented an incident is Libbie's campaign for its removal. Regards, GAC
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Post by elisabeth on May 30, 2006 1:47:41 GMT -6
That's just gorgeous, GAC. Thanks for posting it. Stunning.
Thank goodness we've at least got the photo of the Custer horror, so that we can see what the fuss was about. It's a miracle Libbie didn't destroy all the negatives, too! According to Frost, it's as idiotic as it is because there wasn't enough money for an equestrian statue -- which must have added insult to injury, I should think ...
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Post by Tricia on May 30, 2006 13:50:22 GMT -6
GAC--
I don't think you interpreted my post this way, but I'll just clear things up anyhoo ... in no way was I implying that Donatello's portrayal of David is somehow less a statue than that of Michelangelo's take on the subject, or even Bernini's action-laden marble of the fellow. Nor do I want anyone to think I believe one of the greats of early Renaissance sculpture just wasn't. Indeed, the condotierre is a splendid portrayal of another symbol of Florence!
It just seems that in all culture, when it comes to public art, there is a evolution of "acceptable iconography." Perhaps the rather metrosexual-looking David of Donatello just stopped fitting the bill of the symbolic patron of the Florentine city state and was then forever bypassed by Michelangelo's version of the dude.
Perhaps the sculptor (with the monies allotted) of the Custer gravesite image thought he was capturing the brash, rambunctious Boy General, rather than what we would consider a more "heroic" pose of GAC on Dandy or Vic or Don Juan. But I find it rather odd, that it seems Libbie had a problem with other depictions of her husband that did not portray him upon a horse ... as I recall, she took issue with the New Rumley sculpture, and was more than happy than the Custer in Monroe.
We find ourselves at another problem with public art. It's only as good as the money invested (see the problems with the Ground Zero monument and the Freedom Tower) and folks' interpretation of "heroic," or whatever aura is meant to be invoked by the artist. Granted, said hero's wife should have some say ...
Regards, Leyton McLean
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Post by George Armstrong Custer on May 30, 2006 16:06:19 GMT -6
Glad you liked Il Gattamelata, Elisabeth - these Rennaissance bronzes of the Condottieri which are dotted across Italy really demonstrate the power of a great equestrian statue, don't they? They are quite awesome; as the author of the best history of them in English put it: "Still they ride, throughout Italy, defying us to ignore them." No, Leyton, I wasn't interpreting what you wrote as denigrating one Rennaissance master at the expense of another. I was picking up on your apt analogy of Donatello's somewhat effeminate David in comparison to Michaelangelo's interpretation. Though I don't think the problem with the West Point statue was an effeminate appearance so much as a ridiculous one! And yes, you're right, Libbie was somewhat dismissive of the cloaked New Rumley Custer sculpture - calling it 'too foppish.' You may be on to something that the statues she was most dismissive of were not equestrian figures. The Rennaissance statues of the Condottieri overwhelmingly demonstrate the power of a well executed military equestrian figure. As you also note, of course, filthy lucre comes into the reckoning. Unlike the Custers of this world, the Condottieri and their families amassed fortunes from the rich princes and popes to whom they hired out their military services. When they died, in battle or in bed in one of their fortified palaces, their families and patrons were well able to afford to immortalize them in bronze. Fortuitously, of course, the flowering of Rennaissance art coincided with the period - so there was the money and there was the talent to create works of art that transcend being mere memorials to soldiers. Nothing like this was the case for 19th-century career soldiers such as Custer, of course. Had a Condottieri captain gone down in the blaze of publicity which Custer did, then we can be sure an equestrian bronze masterpiece of him would be glowering across some Italian Piazza to this day. Statue-wise, Custer has done better than most 19th-century soldiers. But there is nothing to compare with that of Il Gattamelata depicted in my earlier post. Nor that of Verrocchio's colossal bronze of Barolomeo Colleoni, whose harsh face, framed in its open helmet, glares down at the traveller in the little square of San Giovanni e Paolo. If, as you suggest, Libbie Custer was an enthusiast for equestrian depictions of her husband, then works such as this suggest she was on to something fundamentally valid as far as the power of inanimate statements are concerned. This 1486 masterpiece is commonly rated as the finest equestrian statue in the world, so the mercenary Colleoni is as assured of his immortality as Libbie could have wished for her man: Regards, GAC
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Post by elisabeth on May 30, 2006 22:30:42 GMT -6
Perhaps she picked up on an undercurrent in the iconography. Custer on foot is unhorsed, powerless; literally, as well as figuratively, brought down to the same level as everyone else. It's also too reminiscent of how he met his end, so she may have sensed that those statues hinted at his defeat rather than any moment of triumph. An equestrian Custer is the Custer of his CW victories ...
On the other hand, she may simply have understood the PR value of making it plain that she, and she alone, was the guardian of his image!
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Post by alfuso on May 30, 2006 23:05:07 GMT -6
Leyton & Elisabeth
ah, but because Libbie had *say* over her husband's statues, there isn't a major city in American that has a statue of Custer. Awkward as it was, the WP statue was at least AT WEST POINT -- now there isn't one at all.
Detroit wanted to put up an equestrian statue of Custer, Libbie interferred. Now there isn't one.
Yes, the Monroe statue is fine, "heroic" but it's not in a major city.
And it's Libbie's fault.
alfuso
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Post by alfuso on May 30, 2006 23:07:09 GMT -6
I have a problem with the placement of the tails on some of those bronzes -- looks like the tail is coming right out of the rectum.
alfuso
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Post by George Armstrong Custer on May 31, 2006 2:54:38 GMT -6
Alfuso - these late mediaeval warhorses of the wealthy had their tails waxed, braided and tied. The resultant stiff appearance is no doubt why you find the tail angle on these bronzes strange. You make a fair point about Libbie's influence being oftentimes counterproductive - certainly in the way she vetoed proposed statues to Custer. This raises the question of whether close relatives are really the best people to wield a determining influence over public commemorations of national figures........ As you note, Monroe has its equestrian Custer. But here's a mystery - what happened to the 20th-century equestrian statue of Custer sculpted by the noted artist Dr. Avard Fairbanks, and which stood at Fort Lincoln State Park, Mandan, Noorth Dakota? The only images I can find of it are old postcards - find one at: www.tias.com/8515/InventoryPage/1694189/1.html?pageNo=1;catId=celebrity-postcardsFairbanks died in 1987, but his website, run by his grandson ( www.avardfairbanks.com) makes no mention of the Custer statue. Anyone know the story of the Fairbanks Custer equestrian? As far as equestrian bronzes of Custer are concerned, my favorite is the commercial work by Russell Hoover, Custer's Last Wave: This limited editon stands just over 12" high, and depicts the moment Custer is supposed to have waved his hat from atop the bluffs to Reno's men in the valley below. Imagine how effective a life-size version would be situated on those bluffs today! The Hoover figure is proof that it is still possible for bronzes to be produced which capture some of the qualities of the great Rennaissance masters. A life-size version - particularly if placed at LBH - would have the same powerful impact on the viewer as the 20th-century statue of Napoleon at the harbor at Cherbourg, which always makes the hairs on my neck stand up: Ciao, GAC
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Post by alfuso on May 31, 2006 6:15:46 GMT -6
The new book LAST IN THEIR CLASS talks of even in late 1890's there was a plan to take the arms off the WP statue a, cut it off at the waist and put it on a pedastal which would have made a decent bust. It was even shipped to New York city (says author) and after that it disappears.
This book is a good read, by the way.
but I hadn't recalled reading anywhere that Custer's "body" was reutrned to Libble with one of the ornate spurs he'd worn since the Civil war which were reputed to have belonged to Santa Anna.
Where was this spur for over a year? It's like the lock of hair that suddenly showed up after the disinterrment.
alfuso
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Post by George Armstrong Custer on May 31, 2006 9:09:02 GMT -6
James S. Robbins, the author of Last In Their Class: Custer, Pickett and the Goats of West Point, is interviewed in the National Review Online. He has this to say of the statue: Lopez: Any fascinating goat mysteries you weren’t able to solve that you still want to? Robbins: The mystery of Custer’s statue! A statue to Custer was erected after his death that his wife so despised she lobbied for years to have it taken down, which it was. It was later shipped to New York to be cut down to a bust by famed architect Stanford White (who designed the Battle Monument at Trophy Point). But White was assassinated by his former mistress’s jealous husband, and the statue (or its pieces) disappeared. Check out the whole interview at: www.nationalreview.com/interrogatory/robbins200603280738.aspThis also has a link to the Last In Their Class website. Ciao, GAC
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Post by alfuso on May 31, 2006 9:47:44 GMT -6
as I said, the book was a good read, great trivia.
I just wish authors would use the *entire* Custer "ambition" quote.
alfuso
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Post by George Armstrong Custer on May 31, 2006 11:40:57 GMT -6
What's germane to the purpose of this thread in the Robbins book is the fact that the statue was shipped from the Point to the NY workshop of Stanford White. Nothing being simple in the realm of Custeriana, White gets himself murdered by a jealous husband, before he can complete his commission of reducing the statue to a more aesthetically pleasing bust.
It would seem very likely from this that the statue (or its already dismembered pieces) were sold off as scrap from the murdered White's workshop when it was cleared out by his executors. Which eliminates any of the speculation that it might be still hidden away in storage at the Point.
Ciao, GAC
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Post by Tricia on May 31, 2006 17:33:30 GMT -6
GAC--
What strikes me as strange is that an architect was hired to fix the statue; granted, Stanford White was a High Victorian luminary. Wasn't his firm responsible for the creation of the Shingle Style so evident in Newport, Rhode Island's Gilded Age "cottages?" Sad that he came to a rather ignoble end ...
Maybe--moving further upon Elisabeth's excellent point of a Boy General portrayed on foot, on "our," the viewer's level, as a colossic failure--the most effective iconography of the cavalryman was the depiction of one upon a horse! Gosh, it can't be that obvious!
I, too, have a favourite depiction of the condotierre. I believe it hangs in the Florentine Palazzo Vecchio, but for the life of me cannot remember the artist--and I've been trying to remember for almost two years as a friend of mine is writing a Leonardo time-travel novella. I know it is not a depiction of Sforza, but the colouration--lots of flashy gold--seems almost Siennese, so I might be completely wrong.
BTW--I like the waving GAC.
Regards, Leyton McLean
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Post by alfuso on May 31, 2006 22:13:28 GMT -6
I got an email from Robbins in reply to one I sent on his book. sounds as if he rather enjoys Custer and is fighting some of the PC revisionism
"Hi Linda, thanks for writing. I'm glad you enjoyed the Goats book, I had a fun time doing the research and writing it. Glad you noted the lack of PC-ness in it, I consciously sought to keep anything like that out. One method was sticking to primary or period sources to the extent possible, and reading as little as possible of the contemporary Custer literature. My favorite cite was the NYT editorial in favor of Washita. Good fun.
"The Custer statue may never be found. I went to NYC to look at the White papers and there were some traces of the statue but nothing on its fate. I even got hold of catalogues from the White estate auction to see if it might have been sold there, but no luck. I think these days it would be a hard sell to get a Custer statue anywhere in the world -- at the very least it would have to include a tribute to his "victims" as well. But the PC view of Custer has held sway for 40 years, so maybe the time is ripe for some new revisionism. I hope people who read my book get the point.
Thanks again, hope you are having a great day!"
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Post by Diane Merkel on May 31, 2006 22:15:58 GMT -6
What's germane to the purpose of this thread in the Robbins book is the fact that the statue was shipped from the Point to the NY workshop of Stanford White. Nothing being simple in the realm of Custeriana, White gets himself murdered by a jealous husband, before he can complete his commission of reducing the statue to a more aesthetically pleasing bust. It would seem very likely from this that the statue (or its already dismembered pieces) were sold off as scrap from the murdered White's workshop when it was cleared out by his executors. Which eliminates any of the speculation that it might be still hidden away in storage at the Point. Ciao, GAC Unbelievable, GAC! I've read a bit about the White murder -- what a great lovers' triangle -- but I didn't know about the connection with Custer's statue. Stanford White was murdered on June 25, 1906, precisely 30 years after Custer's death! www.crimelibrary.com/notorious_murders/classics/white/1.html
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