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Post by custerstillstands on Jan 21, 2006 10:34:29 GMT -6
"True in that respect, but Libbie did have her famous crushes: Wild Bill, Thomas Weir ... maybe others. Perhaps in a strange way, TWC. Certainly she didn't act on them, but she gave her husband as good as she got. "
Excuse me ??!? Libbie just found that these men were handsome, so what? She wasn't courting them or them courting her. Libbie's letter doesn't show any aspect of opportunism or showstar beliefs.
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Post by Tricia on Jan 21, 2006 16:38:58 GMT -6
CSS--
I suggest you read Barnett or "Cavalier in Buckskin." The Custer marriage seemed to be built on flirtations--by both parties. It's what made them so tight, I think. They both appreciated each other's comeliness to members of the opposite sex. In Libbie's case, no, she NEVER acted upon them ... but GAC would go off and stew when Libbie got a bit too friendly with another man, be it a teacher at West Point or a friend. Libbie learned that on their honeymoon, as I recall. This tension was a normal--or was normal--for their marriage and it worked for them, especially after their separation in 1869-70.
Regards, Leyton McLean
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Post by alfuso on Jan 22, 2006 2:34:50 GMT -6
I think the best judge of Libbie's content--when it comes to her husband--is someone who doesn't know much about GAC and is reading her books to try and glean something about his character or person. To a person, I haven't had a reader yet who hasn't returned a volume to me without a comment like, "Come on, nobody is that perfect!" Regards, Leyton McLean I have yet to hear that said to me. alfuso
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Post by custerstillstands on Jan 22, 2006 9:57:46 GMT -6
"I suggest you read Barnett or "Cavalier in Buckskin." The Custer marriage seemed to be built on flirtations--by both parties. It's what made them so tight, I think. They both appreciated each other's comeliness to members of the opposite sex. In Libbie's case, no, she NEVER acted upon them ... but GAC would go off and stew when Libbie got a bit too friendly with another man, be it a teacher at West Point or a friend. Libbie learned that on their honeymoon, as I recall. This tension was a normal--or was normal--for their marriage and it worked for them, especially after their separation in 1869-70."
I've read Touched by fire, again... Libbie was kissed by a teacher, that's all. No flirtations at all. If it's a flirtation, I wonder if talking with somebody meant sleeping with him in your own point of view...
Custer and Libbie knew that they were appealing and were glad about it. Period. Not flirtation. Utley is quoting Benteen about "Libbie's flirts" and really I don't know anyone who trust Benteen (except you, of course).
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Post by custerstillstands on Jan 22, 2006 9:59:04 GMT -6
"I suggest you read Barnett or "Cavalier in Buckskin." The Custer marriage seemed to be built on flirtations--by both parties. It's what made them so tight, I think. They both appreciated each other's comeliness to members of the opposite sex. In Libbie's case, no, she NEVER acted upon them ... but GAC would go off and stew when Libbie got a bit too friendly with another man, be it a teacher at West Point or a friend. Libbie learned that on their honeymoon, as I recall. This tension was a normal--or was normal--for their marriage and it worked for them, especially after their separation in 1869-70." I've read Touched by fire, again... Libbie was kissed by a teacher, that's all. No flirtations at all. If it's a flirtation, I wonder if talking with somebody meant sleeping with him in your own point of view...
Custer and Libbie knew that they were appealing and were glad about it. Period. Not flirtation. Utley is quoting Benteen about "Libbie's flirts" and really I don't know anyone who trust Benteen (except you, of course).
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Post by Tricia on Jan 22, 2006 10:05:01 GMT -6
CSS--
Who is saying Libbie slept with anybody else? It is certainly not I who is doing so, nor is it anything I would vaguely even consider for a moment to be in her character. After that incident at West Point, Libbie became kind of unnerved when after boarding the train, GAC went into complete silence. In a later incident, Libbie also tore up a photo of a young lady GAC had sent her (I believe in 1871 or 1872) through the mails. I think Monaghan sums up GAC's braggadocio as "artless."
You're taking an observation and turning it into crime. I'm doing no such thing. I prefer to examine the whole, and you prefer to exist in the myth.
Regards, Leyton McLean
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Post by custerstillstands on Jan 22, 2006 10:17:06 GMT -6
Is that flirtation They are just testing their love, nothing really new or really awful... No flirtation in there. Almost normal with a couple of "stars".
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Post by custerstillstands on Jan 22, 2006 10:21:21 GMT -6
And about the West Point "incident" : Custer was a little big jealous but Libbie wasn't flirting with the teacher...
Custer wasn't so kind with Libbie when he wrote her in the 1870s about a girl he followed in the street for "sport". But it's not flirting anyway, because there's no proof that he even talk with the lady or did something else...
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Post by alfuso on Jan 22, 2006 11:48:57 GMT -6
Is that flirtation They are just testing their love, nothing really new or really awful... No flirtation in there. Almost normal with a couple of "stars". See this in the context of its time. Flirting was a Victorian artform. alfuso
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Post by Tricia on Jan 22, 2006 11:49:35 GMT -6
CSS--
"They were just testing their love ..."
If that isn't flirtation, I don't know what is. Flirtation is a generally innocent "sport" and both the Custers were anything but rank amateurs at it.
Regards, Leyton McLean
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Post by alfuso on Jan 23, 2006 4:43:06 GMT -6
seems to me that Benteen was a pretty good revisionist...
alfuso
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Post by Tricia on Jan 23, 2006 10:28:39 GMT -6
seems to me that Benteen was a pretty good revisionist... alfuso Perhaps, but there was that one letter from GAC to LBC regarding his opinion of Weir. It's been a while since I read it, but I believe it was cautionary in nature and showed some disappointment in her taste of companions. Regards, LMC
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Post by custerstillstands on Jan 24, 2006 5:33:51 GMT -6
Perhaps, but there was that one letter from GAC to LBC regarding his opinion of Weir. It's been a while since I read it, but I believe it was cautionary in nature and showed some disappointment in her taste of companions.
I don't see any flirtation here. She just found Weir handsome. Like Wild Bill. Nothing else.
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Post by Tricia on Jan 24, 2006 9:44:07 GMT -6
I'm not gonna argue with you over mere semantics, CSS. If you want to discuss Libbie and her relationship to history or her relationship to GAC, that's great with me, as I enjoy the gossipy stuff immensely. But I'm not going to waste my time dissecting what the meaning of "is" is.
Regards, Leyton McLean
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Post by bubbabod on Feb 12, 2006 0:35:01 GMT -6
While searching earlier this evening for the names of the soldiers with the "Custer cannon" In the 1919 NY Times paper, I came across an article about West Point giving the okay to melt down about 20 cannon and use the metal to make a Custer statue that was placed at West Point. Libbie was mad because she wasn't consulted about and didn't like the person who designed and made the sculpture. She said the statue made him look too old, objected. It was removed from the grounds, put in a warehouse and hasn't been seen since. Yeah, I think she was a revisionist and also had the ability to force her will on some, guilting them out, so to speak.
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