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Post by Tricia on Jan 18, 2006 9:21:17 GMT -6
All--
I'm thinking Diane brought this up on another thread, but it was an interesting enough point to start its own. Was Libbie just a loyal widow securing her husband's reputation or a mythmaker supreme? Was she the "ultimate revisionist?" And how much, if any, did she--through her 50+ year widowhood--hurt any unbiased study of her husband's final battle?
Regards, Leyton McLean
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Post by crzhrs on Jan 18, 2006 11:59:36 GMT -6
There may have been a time while Libbie was alive that dissing Custer was not PC. But once Libbie died the wolves started howling, starting with GLORY HUNTER, published not long after Libbie's death.
How much of a factor was not insulting Libbie played in that, I don't know, but was it a coincidence that GLORY HUNTER was published so soon after her death?
Another point, Libbie received only a small pittance for a pension after her husband's death. She needed to make a living . . . what else but write books and do lectures about her husband, their life together, and his honor.
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Post by custerstillstands on Jan 19, 2006 9:59:53 GMT -6
Libbie told the world that his husband was betrayed and that he wasn't an Indian killer but a devoted husband.
And History agrees with her.
Revisionism is mostly the work of Native Americans, past and present.
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Post by custerstillstands on Jan 19, 2006 10:02:39 GMT -6
"Another point, Libbie received only a small pittance for a pension after her husband's death. She needed to make a living . . . what else but write books and do lectures about her husband, their life together, and his honor. "
She loved her, she didn't spend all his life talking about Custer for money. Instead of people like you who love to praise Glory Hunter and the worst fiction books about Custer, Libbie cared about Custer's honor and truth.
General Miles told her, along with so many veterans, that her husband was betrayed on the field and kicked by liars after his death. And it's was the ultimate truth. We just have to look at some posts right here to be convinced that PC bia and anti-Custer forgeries are still fashionable.
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Post by crzhrs on Jan 19, 2006 10:05:21 GMT -6
<Revisionism is mostly the work of Native Americans, past and present.>
Yep . . . those savage Indians are at it again!
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Post by custerstillstands on Jan 19, 2006 10:38:39 GMT -6
Thanks for your posts, crzhrs, no evidence, no page, nothing to the contrary, thank you very much. We learn a lot with you!
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Post by Tricia on Jan 19, 2006 11:00:34 GMT -6
"Another point, Libbie received only a small pittance for a pension after her husband's death. She needed to make a living . . . what else but write books and do lectures about her husband, their life together, and his honor. " She loved her, she didn't spend all his life talking about Custer for money. Instead of people like you who love to praise Glory Hunter and the worst fiction books about Custer, Libbie cared about Custer's honor and truth. General Miles told her, along with so many veterans, that her husband was betrayed on the field and kicked by liars after his death. And it's was the ultimate truth. We just have to look at some posts right here to be convinced that PC bia and anti-Custer forgeries are still fashionable. Come on, CSS ... GAC left the woman practically broke. The woman had to find employment in a period when that kind of thing was a social rarity. Libbie found selling her husband's reputation (which is not necessarily a bad thing) an easier way to make money, as well as make the political statement you have suggested. I am thinking this is well-covered in Touched By Fire. Regards, Leyton McLean
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Post by custerstillstands on Jan 19, 2006 11:03:09 GMT -6
I read "Touched by fire", but what about Libbie's personal life ? She never had an other man ! NEVER.
The best way to have money if you are a Victorian woman is to marry a rich man. Everybody wanted to marry Libbie, as a veteran remembered in 1910.
Jacqueline Kennedy wasn't left alone and she was rich, but she found a husband anyway.
Money cannot explain the Libbie's enduring devotion.
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Post by Tricia on Jan 19, 2006 11:26:24 GMT -6
CSS--
I don't think this is a truism for Libbie, but there is a bit of the Pricilla Presley thing about her. Keeping that last name was her own best ticket to riches. But my problem is that Libbie's books really don't do much to shed "reality" upon her marriage to GAC or his personal nature. The marriage ebbed, flowed and had more than its share of problems ... mostly due her husband's own decisions and foibles.
Regards, Leyton McLean
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Post by elisabeth on Jan 20, 2006 5:29:11 GMT -6
Who was it who described Libbie as "the best press agent a man ever had"? (Not a rhetorical question -- I truly can't remember!)
She really achieved a kind of double whammy with Custer's reputation, didn't she. First, by creating that fictitious image in her books; and second, by inhibiting anyone else from dishing the dirt on him. All those Reno Hill survivors saying their lips are sealed "while Mrs. Custer yet lives". So many of them drop really tantalising hints about the revelations that will pour forth as soon as she's out of the way ... And then she gets the last laugh by outliving the lot of them.
Yes, I think you put your finger on it in your first post in this thread. Libbie's the reason we're still debating the battle today. Without her influence, we might have had the full story long ago!
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Post by Tricia on Jan 20, 2006 17:30:06 GMT -6
I read "Touched by fire", but what about Libbie's personal life ? She never had an other man ! NEVER. CSS-- True in that respect, but Libbie did have her famous crushes: Wild Bill, Thomas Weir ... maybe others. Perhaps in a strange way, TWC. Certainly she didn't act on them, but she gave her husband as good as she got. An associate of mine is marketing a book she's written about Wild Bill and she is dumbfounded by the attraction! Regards, Leyton McLean
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Post by weir on Jan 20, 2006 18:36:52 GMT -6
We know a dedicated woman in love with Custer until the end of her life, who wrote books to defend his name is an horrible noble subject for the XXst century.
Let invent a new dark story just for fun... Who votes whe was attracted to Wild Bill Hicock...? That she kept her name for money ? That in fact Libby never loved GAC but used him as a patsy...?
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Post by Tricia on Jan 20, 2006 21:30:54 GMT -6
West--
It's a noble thing to be loyal to your husband, even to the grave ... it's quite another thing to create an image of him that in no way resembles reality. Libbie's books have nothing on A Million Little Pieces it seems ...
Regards, Leyton McLean
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Post by alfuso on Jan 21, 2006 7:38:38 GMT -6
Rice s "that in no way resemble reality" Where do you get that?
Libbie's anecdotes about garrison life and her husband's foibles and silliness and games are priceless. Are you saying that they are all untrue? She totally invented her life with Custer?
I love her tales of neither of them having the courage to face Eliza on wash day when she was in a bad temper. "You tell her." No, you tell her!"
Of her early discovery of how to help her officer husband into his sash. Of her rememrace of knowng he was coming to her by hearing his saber clink on the stairs.
Those are the kind of little incidents that actually do happen with couples. And I enjoy Libbie's books for that.
Also her look at garrison life, the way enlisted men were treated. How the officers' wives had to get along because they were the only friends they all had.
A book that has little to do with reality is Van De Water's endless litaney of "Glory Hunter" whenever he speaks of Custer. Turning Custer's genuinely brilliant CW career into a series of acts of vengence and lucky mistakes.
Le's get real, here, Rice.
alfuso
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Post by Tricia on Jan 21, 2006 8:27:51 GMT -6
I think the best judge of Libbie's content--when it comes to her husband--is someone who doesn't know much about GAC and is reading her books to try and glean something about his character or person. To a person, I haven't had a reader yet who hasn't returned a volume to me without a comment like, "Come on, nobody is that perfect!"
You won't get arguments from me about the atmosphere of LBC's writings or the nuances of life in the frontier, but I maintain that she offers a view of Custer that's a bit skewed from his real person ... and in a way, causes just as much damage to a "real" portrait of the man as does Van de Water.
Regards, Leyton McLean
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