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Post by grahamew on Dec 18, 2006 12:16:33 GMT -6
Here's one for you, Charlie
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Post by harpskiddie on Dec 18, 2006 13:40:11 GMT -6
grahamew:
Where did you get this? It looks like a modern rendition, with Yellow Nose sort of resembling the Frankenstein Monster, and the colors out of whack.
Gordie
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Post by grahamew on Dec 18, 2006 16:56:48 GMT -6
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Post by grahamew on Dec 18, 2006 17:19:08 GMT -6
Here's a portrait of Yellow Nose by Daniel Little Chief: Check out this page for documentation: The SIRIS record page: tinyurl.com/y3ar3o[Modified to activate link -- DM]
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Post by harpskiddie on Dec 18, 2006 18:30:24 GMT -6
Thank you very much.
Gordie
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Post by Scout on Dec 18, 2006 20:53:24 GMT -6
"He is the man who killed General Custer by stabbing the wounded man with a butcher knife in the (?) part of the neck." ? Interesting stuff. Thanks.
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Post by harpskiddie on Dec 18, 2006 23:19:29 GMT -6
Scout:
'fore part' - which I interpret as meaning the throat. I have never seen any description of Custer's body which mentions a wound of this sort [which means nothing, probably, since the scene was 'prettified' for the GAP], nor had I heard of Yellow Nose in connection with the final incidents on LSH. His taking of the guidon and later counting coup with it has been very well reported over the years, and I had heard of it in 1960 when I was in Busby.
Gordie
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Post by elisabeth on Dec 19, 2006 3:06:54 GMT -6
Interesting that the drawing shows two guidons down already. How literally can we take this? The usual version is that this feat came early in the battle, at MTF. But the two fallen guidons would seem to imply that two companies had already been defeated, which would make it later.
The guidon-bearer is on a bay horse, so it's a bay-horse company (F, I or L); the stance of the officer, and the massed carbines, suggest that the troop in question is still in good shape at this stage. Do the carbines indicate a volley, would you think? Or is it a mistake to try to read too much into this?
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Post by shan on Dec 19, 2006 3:52:37 GMT -6
Elizabeth,
this is one of a number of drawings made either by Yellow Nose himself, or by Spotted Wolf, who was his adoptive father, who included some of Yellow Nose's exploits in a ledger book he made. As a general rule we can pretty much accept the deeds these drawings depict, as the warriors peer group would be waiting in the wings, only too eager to swoop upon, and unpick another mans account, whether that be in oral form or visual, if he dared to claim more than he actually did. Given that reputation was all in these warrior societies, it was just too risky to claim deeds of daring do that you hadn't committed. Having said that, Yellow Nose and White Bull seem to have been so active in this battle, one might be forgiven for thinking that they managed to wipe out Custers whole command between them. Of course the fact that the drawings have to compress time and space, make many of the encounters look as if they involved the combatants being in much closer contact than they may have been in reality, but that had more to do with the constraints of the medium rather than an exaggeration on the part of the man involved. In her book,' For all to see, ' by Sandra Brizee-Bowen, { terribly expensive,} she includes a number of the drawingthat were made of his exploits during this battle, { awful reproductions,} and discusses where they might have happened. Like most of us who read or contribute to these boards, I have read about the incident shown in the drawing above in numerous books on the subject, everyone seemingly placing it on a different part of the field to everyone else. Indian reports aren't much help either as they are not really concerned with describing time or place, so much as the deed itself. One last thing, amongst Yellow Nose's own drawings, are two extremely interesting portrayals of women warriors, which are quite startling given that this is a somewhat prudish society, one of these can be seen in ' Visions of the People,' by Even Maurer Shan
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Post by elisabeth on Dec 19, 2006 4:26:07 GMT -6
Thanks, Shan. I'd love to see those women warrior pictures. Fascinating. Incidentally, what do you think of the possibility that Kate Bighead's account of her involvement in the battle might have been heavily self-censored? There's a photo of her here: www.tuellpioneer.com/chiefkate.htmlshowing her in full warrior garb, and captioned with the statement that she "counted coup many times". It'd be fun to think she was just kidding Marquis along with her innocent "looking for my nephew" story, and that she was as active in the fighting as anyone else!
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Post by charlie on Dec 19, 2006 7:42:00 GMT -6
Thank you for the informations and drawings (very very simple, but.....). However, I hope that anyone post a real photo of him; i don't think that a great warrior as him is never been photographed.....I love too much indian's chief photos (don't you are still perceive....?).
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Post by Scout on Dec 19, 2006 8:03:06 GMT -6
Are there any photos of Yellow Nose? I don't recall seeing any. Was any known by any other name and when did he die?
Off the top of my head...weren't there over a dozen guidons at the battle?
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Post by crzhrs on Dec 19, 2006 9:30:27 GMT -6
We know of a number of woman warriors, especially Buffalo Calf Road Woman who played a prominent part at the Rosebud. She is mentioned in Cheyenne oral history as being the person who inflicted a wound to Custer at the LBH.
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Post by crzhrs on Dec 19, 2006 9:32:11 GMT -6
What Indians meant in their drawings may be completly different to a Western's view of what they are seeing.
As much can be lost in a drawing as can be lost in verbal translation.
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Post by grahamew on Dec 19, 2006 16:02:49 GMT -6
collections.unionstation.org/detail.php?type=related&kv=69328&t=objectsCover, Tipi, Miniature Yellow Nose; Wolf Chief's wife Indian Territory, Darlington Agency 1884-1885 Canvas, beads, pigment Cheyenne 80 in. x 61 in. (approximately) Ida Dyer commissioned Yellow Nose to paint this tipi cover (made by Wolf Chief's wife), a buffalo robe and several drawings. He was born Ute, but captured as a child and raised by Cheyenne. In her book _Fort Reno_, pp. 96-99, Dyer describes his studio and work in great detail. There is also a photograph of him in that book. She called him "an artist of no mean import", and she was "...anxious to watch this talented 'Yelow-Nose' at his work..." Regarding his studio "it was swept clean and the place had a tidy appearance...He was a man of smaller stature than either the Cheyennes or Arrapahoes...His hair was unkempt, and he wore it bushy around his head and ears, while the ends that hung low on each shoulder were brought to the front and tied with old string...He was working on my tepee canvas. He had it drawn over an improvised table of boards. At his side were a number of sticks, six or seven inches in length, whittled to a sharp point that he used for brushes. A bottle of indelible black ink, red ink, and colored pencils...all kinds of dyes and colored powders...comprised his materials...The lodge he was painting was a minature affair of five feet made by Cheyenne "Wolf-Chief's squaw [sic]' on one of my visits to Cantonment...I spend half a day trying to learn the intricate workings...in putting it up, my stupidity displayed giving much amusement..." (_Fort Reno_, pp. 96-99) George Bent also wrote about Yellow Nose, "In 1858 Lean Bear captured Yellow Nose and his mother, a Ute woman. The mother later escaped and rejoined her people. In 1862 I saw her living with the Utes; yet Yellow Nose, her son, became one of the most famous of Cheyenne Warriors." (_A Life of George Bent_, p. 297.) 1940.229.web So a photo does exist...
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