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Post by Scout on Apr 14, 2007 5:06:59 GMT -6
According to rch Morris was given an honorable discharge. The term 'worthless character' was just a general description of his personality I guess. He served honorably but was worthless...what a contradiction.
Were judges elected or appointed in NYC at that time? That could answer some questions about the man and his achievements.
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Post by fred on Apr 14, 2007 9:49:21 GMT -6
How could a $13 a month pvt get a $20 a month pension except through politics? Inflation.
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Post by rch on Apr 19, 2007 23:53:07 GMT -6
Aside from the fact that the terms "honorable" and "dishonorable" where used in connection with discharges I haven't been able to find out just how they were used.
In "Forty Miles a Day on Beans and Hay," Don Rickey describes "bobtail" discharges. He says that the discharge certificates in these cases simply had the character section clipped off and that they were dishonorable discharges. I think he is wrong.
In his bibliography Rickey lists the 1863 Army regulations, but he didn't site them for his explanation of the "bobtail" discharge.
I only have the 1861 regulations (these are available on line). Basically this is what they say:
Except for expiration of his term of enlistment, an enlisted man could be discharged on the authoity of:
1. The War Department 2. The sentence of a general court-martial 3. A Department commander 4. A commander of an army in the field 5. A certificate of disability 6. An application by a soldier after 20 years of service
It does not appear that company commanders had any right to summarily discharge any enlisted man, or they would have done so before the enlistment expired. They did have the right to make a statement of "character."
On discharge a soldier was entitled to a certificate and the certificate had to state the reason for the discharge.
The "character" section of the certificate was at the bottom and below the signature of the officer discharging the man. The 1861 regulations state "The cause of discharge will be stated in the body of the discharge, and the space at the foot for character cut off, unless a recommendation is given." It appears to me that the "character" section was optional.
The record of these character references was obviously kept by the the Army, for Nichols gives them in "Men With Custer," but an enlisted man like Morris could easily clip a bad reference off his own discharge. The important part of the discharge was the reason for the discharge.
For those who have copies of William O. Taylor's "With Custer on the Little Bighorn," there is a photo of Taylor's discharge on page 120. According to Nichols, Taylor's character reference was "a poor soldier." The certificate is cut off above the signature line. The reason for the discharge is "Expiration of term of service."
These references may have had to do with re-enlistment.
I have photo copies of two discharges given to a grandfather of my uncle by marriage. These discharges don't include character references which may have been clipped, but they do have the sentence "No objection to his being re-enlisted is known to exist." This sentence was in parenthesis, and I think it probable that a line could be drawn through the sentence if the officer discharging the man objected to his re-enlistment. This may have been a form that was used for the U. S. Volunteers during the Civil War.
In the case of my uncle's grandfather, the reason for one discharge was so that he could re-enlist and the reason for the second was a War Department order dated 5 Jun 65 which I suppose had to do with mustering out volunteer regiments.
When a soldier was discharged by sentence of a general court-martial, the word "dishonorable" may have been included in the reason for the discharge, however I have never seen such a discharge.
I don"t think any great amount of political influence was necessary to get a pension. In the late 1800's congressmen were just as tickled pink to help constituents get benefits as they are today. There are those that believe that the most powerfull officer of the Army in the late 19th century was the head of the Pension Bureau.
rch
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Post by Diane Merkel on Oct 12, 2007 20:54:02 GMT -6
Fred asked me to look for census records for Morris. I think this is his son's WWII Registration Card (1942). I believe I have found "our" Morris in the 1910 census in the Bronx. His son has different middle initials, which is strange, but his age fits the guy who registered above. The others are "Jr.'s" wife and children. Name & Age William E Morris 51 Sarah A Morris 50 William C J Morris 29 Edith M Morris 28 Edna M Morris 4 William E D Morris 2 Then he and Sarah are alone in 1920: Name & Age William Morris 58 Sarah Morris 58 This guy is amazing! He only aged 7 years in a decade! Fred, please go back and read Barbara Morris' original post that started this thread. I can look before 1910 if you like, but I think this guy was a pathological liar, as least as far as his age was concerned.
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annl
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Post by annl on Jun 25, 2009 7:14:45 GMT -6
Hi all, just signed on because I'm doing a little research on my family. I am the Great-great grandaughter of William Ephraim Morris---The Edna May in the 1920 census records is my grandmother. very cool stuff.
From our family tradition, W.E. Morris enlisted in the cavalry at 14 or 15--lying about his age---, fought at little bighorn, then a couple of years later discharged for "worthless character". He married Sarah Kench from Brooksville Maine, went to law school at what would become NYU, then later became a judge. He was involved in the Tamany Hall political machine, but he was supposedly a big champion of women's rights as well. If any of you have found additional info, please feel free to e-mail me. Love to hear it.
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Carl
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Post by Carl on May 7, 2012 16:01:57 GMT -6
From "The Custer Tragedy", Fred Dustin, 1939
The late Judge William E. Morris, of New York City, then a private in French's troop says: "On the left of 'M' Troop and about twenty yards away was a mound, behind which was Bloody Knife, and about fifteen Ree scouts, Charles Reynolds, the negro Isaiah, the two doctors and others". Morris had been among the ten troopers, who, under First Sergeant John Ryan, had scouted the woods...
Judge Morris has made the following statement over his own signature (Personal letter to Robert Bruce with copies to Major A. B. Ostrander and E. A. Brininstool).
"I heard Reno say "men, we are surrounded, draw your revolvers and follow me:. Somebody (but not Reno) cried: "Every man for himself:..... I tried to mount my horse... made a flying leap ... I on my stomach across the saddle... There was no one in sight when I left... The Indians were closing in between the troops and myself ...Two Indians got so close to me that I thought they were going to lasso me. I opened fire on them.. and fired six shots. Emptied my six shooter and they disappeared... I made for the river, jumped my horse off the bank.. which proved to be deep... crossed to the opposite side... when I arrived there, Lieut. Hodgson was in the river... I did not know until I reached him that he had been wounded. I saw that the water was crimson around his leg and thighs... Two men, Turley and Rye were wedged in the narrow pony trail or cut- neither would allow the other to go ahead.. The bullets were flying like hailstones. I rode behind these two men, and Hodgson reached out and said to me, "For God;s sake don't leave me here, I am shot through both legs". I said "All right, grab hold". I gave him my right stirrup, and took my left foot out also so as to make room for his body on the right side. He took hold of the stirrup with both hands, and I grabbed him by the collar, a firm grip, with my right hand. I grabbed a lock of my horse's mane well forward and called to Rye and Turley: "One of you fellows pull back and let the other go up" Rye pulled back. Turley went up, and was killed with ten feet of the top of the cut. Rye went up without being hit. I followed with Hodgson. I had a firm grip on him and he was safe until the third plunge of the horse, which took us half way up the cut...He let go, and all his weight fell upon me.. He fell to the ground in the middle of the cut.... His weight pulled my saddle back... and almost dislocated my arm and shoulder... two-thirds of the way up, I overtook Privates Dave Gordon and Bill Myers... The next second we were all three hit...(Gordon and Myers were instantly killed). I was shot through the left breast and was bleeding profusely and unable to mount. I grabbed my stirrup and gave my horse his head, and with his aid, I succeeded in getting to the top of the bluff."
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Carl
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Posts: 125
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Post by Carl on May 7, 2012 19:10:14 GMT -6
More on Morris (from a Genealogy web site)
"The Bronx and Its People: A History, 1609-1927. Anonymous; New York: Lewis Hist. Pub. Co. (1927), 1378 pgs." According to the article, he was born 1 May 1861 in Boston, MA. I know it is not considered a proof source, but it may still be helpful. Here is the entire article (p.265):
"Judge William Ephraim MORRIS
"For more than forty-one years Judge William Ephraim MORRIS has been engaged in legal practice in New York City, where he is now (1927) a judge of the Municipal Court. Judge MORRIS was admitted to the New York State bar September 23, 1886, and has been continuously engaged in practice since that time.
"William E. MORRIS, father of Judge MORRIS, was born in Rochester, New York, in 1831, and died in Boston, Massachusetts, October 11, 1878, son of Halstead, who was born in Morristown, New Jersey, and Hannah (TOOLEY) MORRIS; and grandson of Stephen MORRIS, a native of Morristown, New Jersey. He [William E. MORRIS] married Lovina TIBBETS, who was born in Brooksville, Maine, daughter of Noah and Elvina T. (BOLTON) TIBBETTS, and granddaughter of David and Katie (CONDON) BOLTON, of Brooksville, Maine.
"Judge William Ephraim MORRIS, son of William E. and Lovina (TIBBETTS) MORRIS, was born in Boston, Massachusetts, May 1, 1861, and received his education in the public schools of Boston and in the English High School there. After leaving school he entered the United States Army, as a member of the Seventh United States Cavalry, where he served for two years and three months, during which time he was a participant in the battle of Little Big Horn (the Custer massacre), and received during that engagement, a gunshot wound in the left breast. After the completion of two years and three months of service he returned to New York City and entered the University of the City of New York, now New York University, and began the study of law. He continued his studies until he was admitted to the bar, September 23, 1886. The following day, September 24, he opened his office for practice, and it is interesting to note that his first case was a case in the Federal Court, a case which is still pending (1927)[!]. Judge MORRIS is the only survivor of those who participated in that case. During the forty-one years which have passed since Judge MORRIS was admitted to the bar he has been continuously and successfully engaged in legal work. He continued his private practice until he was elected a judge of the Municipal Court of New York City, in which capacity he is still serving.
"For the past twenty-five years, Judge MORRIS has been a member of Bronx Council, Royal Arcanum. He is also a member of Bronx Lodge, No. 871, Benevolent and Protective Order of Elks; and of the Order of Indian Wars, composed of ex-service officers and medal men. He is a member of The Bronx Bar Association, a member and one of the organizers of the North End Democratic Club, of which he was the first president; and an executive member of Tammany Hall, 35th District, from 1906 to 1912.
"Judge William Ephraim MORRIS was married, in Calvary Baptist Church on Twenty-third Street, New York City, by Rev. Dr. Robert S. McARTHUR, December 7, 1879, to Sarah Abbie KENCH, daughter of Captain John Edward KENCH, a native of Brooksville, Maine, who was a deep sea sailor and captain of the brig "Mary Means," and of Abbie (COUSINS) KENCH, who was born in Brooksville, Maine, daughter of Jacob COUSINS, who was in Captain EMERSON's company, Massachusetts Militia, during the War of 1812, and was a pensioner of that war. The paternal grandfather of Mrs. MORRIS was Sargent Thomas KENCH, who scaled the wall of Quebec with General WOLFE and afterwards became color bearer for Benedict ARNOLD. He later settled on Swans Island, Maine, where he was the only inhabitant, and his last years were spent in Brooksville, Maine. In the State House at Boston there is commemoration of his heroic deeds. Mr. and Mrs. MORRIS are the parents of one son, William Ephraim, Jr., born August 22, 1880, who married Edith COOMBS. They have three children: Edna May, who is a student in Barnard College, class of 1927; William Ephraim (4); and George Elwell. The family home is at No. 2780 Pond Place, the Bronx."
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Post by fred on May 8, 2012 7:22:16 GMT -6
Carl, This is really good stuff... where were you when I was writing that damn book? <g> A few years ago a woman named Barbara Morris came on this site looking for information of William Ephraim. If I remember correctly, she lived in Texas and was an older descendant of the man. Her family knew of his LBH participation as well as his stint as a NYC judge and they were trying to find out exactly when he was born. They had several dates, including that 1861 number, but no one was certain. Even the family records couldn't accurately pinpoint it. Roger Williams estimated it was 1858 and the best I was able to come up with was 1854-- which, because of the battle's date-- I would suspect is the most accurate of all (I mention all three in the book). Anyway, Barbara and I both knew Morris was buried in Kensico Cemetery in Valhalla, NY, and to me that would solve all the issues. Valhalla is only a couple of miles from where I live and I know that "cemetery row" over there rather well. (Kensico is next to Gate of Heaven, a Catholic cemetery-- and I believe another, a Jewish cemetery-- and between the whole complex, you have some very famous people: Babe Ruth, Lou Gehrig, Danny Kaye, the Russian-born composer, Rachmaninoff, and many, many others.) So... I went there, went to the office and they printed out all their records regarding the Morris burial. If an actual date-of-birth were available, they would have it surely. Then I went to the gravestone... and Morris had even befuddled the cemetery. No d-o-b. I will try to post a photo of his gravestone here.... Anyway, I think we are doomed to guessing. The 1861 date is much too early and those papers have to be wrong, especially since he enlisted in 1875, making him only 14, even crazier than the Willis Wright enlistment age (as best I can determine, Wright was the youngest person in the Seventh). I tried to contact Barbara Morris again-- we began e-mailing one another-- but she never responded, so I assumed she had died. By the way, if you hunt it all down-- maybe even on this thread, I haven't looked-- you will find the initial discussion between us and she may have included more info for you. Now let me try to post that picture of Morris' gravestone... Best wishes, Fred. Attachments:
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Post by fred on May 8, 2012 7:44:42 GMT -6
Carl, I just went back over this entire thread... everything is there, including a post from someone named, "anni," another Morris descendant. Her e-mail is listed there, so I am going to try to contact her.
You will also see posts by "d o harris" and "Scout." Dale Harris was one of the real LBH brains, and unfortunately died... about 70 or 71, I think. "Scout" was Mike Nunnally, who also died... December, 2010... of asthma. Both really great fellows; I particularly miss Nunnally, who I had met at the LBH and who had introduced me to the McFarland publishing people.
If I contact "anni," I will let you know.
In the meantime, I will put up-- separately-- my Morris "profile."
Best wishes, Fred.
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Post by fred on May 8, 2012 8:02:34 GMT -6
Here is my profile of William Ephraim Morris. My comments are in yellow.
PVT WILLIAM EPHRAIM MORRIS (M)
1908—From a letter dated November 1, 1908, to Walter Camp. Denver Public Library, Robert S. Ellison papers, WH131 File Folder, Papers – Diaries – Interviews – Comments. Donohue, Michael N., Drawing Battle Lines, El Segundo, CA: Upton and Sons, Publishers, 2008.
1. There was very little timber at the first crossing. [128]
2. Custer’s column and Reno’s column rode side by side for at least ½ mile. Morris does not remember seeing Cooke or Keogh with Reno. CPT French was a few yards behind Reno and 1SG Ryan was directly behind French. [128]
3. M Company was on the right going down the valley and on the left on the skirmish line. [128]
4. M was “the first in and the last out.” [128]
5. They could not see Custer’s command after they swung to the right because of intervening hills. [128]
6. French directed SGT O’Harra to make sure the sets of fours closed up and O’Harra stood in the river [at Ford A] to make sure no one stopped to water his horse. Morris did, pretending not to hear O’Harra’s yelling at him. [128]
7. Morris stated categorically that “the outfit” did not stop to water the horses. [128]
8. “When the three troops had crossed the river, there were plenty of Indians in view, but they were trekking down the bottom and riding as fast as they could. Command was given: ‘left into line, gallop! Forward guide right!’” [129]
9. There was a lot of crowding of horse and they became unmanageable. [129]
10. Reno directed French to send 10 men to skirmish the woods to avoid ambush. Morris was one of the ten. [130]
11. After riding down the valley and dismounting, one company was formed up “as skirmishers facing down the bottom.” [130]
12. “ ‘M’ Troop was deployed facing the bench land.” [130]
13. About 20 yards away there was a small mound and behind the mound were Bloody Knife, Dorman, Reynolds, docs Porter and DeWolf, about 15 Rees, and some others. [130]
14. M Company advanced toward the benchland and the Indians began coming at them from their right. [130]
15. French told them to fire at will and they continued to move toward the benchland. [130]
16. When the company was within 400 yards of the Indians, French ordered them to lie down and fire. [130]
17. The firing was very heavy on both sides. [130]
18. Morris figured they were there about 15 minutes. [130]
19. [In 1993 Jason Pitsch found evidence of a skirmish line about 400 yards from and parallel to the western valley bluffs. {130}]
Undated Walter Camp interview. This “interview” was probably taken from correspondence between them, possibly even the letter cited above. Custer in '76.
1. Lorentz was shot in the stomach in the timber. Neely and Morris tried to lift him onto a horse, but Lorentz refused to be helped. He was in great distress. [131]
2. Summers was killed just as he came out of the timber. [131]
3. Says SGT Carey was not left in the timber. [131]
4. George E. Smith was killed at the edge of the timber. [131]
5. Turley was killed only 20 feet from where LT Hodgson was killed. [131]
6. Half way to the river Scollin’s horse went down and Thorpe stopped to help him, but Thorpe’s horse was also shot. Thorpe grabbed an Indian pony and got away, but Scollin was killed there. [131]
7. Meyer and Gordon were killed where the bluffs began to get steep. [131]
8. Indians were firing at them from the bluffs on the east side of the river. [131]
9. LT McIntosh was killed within 20 yards of the river. [132]
10. Said LT Hare was the last one out of the timber. [132]
11. There was a washout on the east side of the riverbank and that was where the men were able to get out of the water and up the bank. [132]
Impressions:
• Deaths in Reno’s command • Indians on east side of LBH • Location of Reno’s re-crossing of LBH
1928—Carroll, John M., The Battles of the Little Big Horn, p. 18. From a letter written by Morris to Robert Bruce, May 23, 1928. This was from an e-mail dated January 29, 2011, and a post by January 21, 2011, by Jose Luis Arcon – Dominguez.
“And now Morris enters in scene. The battalion is halted and consolidated, all the men are on foot, and number 4’s are holding the horses back of the line. At this point of his long narrative to R. Bruce, Morris says that,
‘Major Reno directed Captain French to send ten men from the right of his troop to skirmish the woods –to avoid ambush– before directing the number 4’s to proceed with the led horses to cover. I was one of the ten men so detailed. First Sgt. Ryan, in charge of the detail, gave the command —Double time! when we were close to the wood, and then —As skirmishers, march! We entered the woods, skirmished them to the river, saw no Indians in the woods and immediately returned. When First Sgt. Ryan signalled Major Reno All right, no Indians in the woods!, number 4’s were then directed to take the horses into the woods, and we –detail– rejoined the troop.’…
“‘We [Ryan’s detail] entered the woods, skirmished them to the river, saw no Indians in the woods and immediately RETURNED. When First Sgt. Ryan signaled Major Reno ‘All right, no Indians in the woods,’ number 4’s were then directed to take the horses into the woods, and we –detail– REJOINED the troop […] M Troop was deployed facing the bench land […] Command was given by Captain French to fire at will, and we proceeded forward toward the bench land.’”
Best wishes, Fred.
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Post by fred on May 8, 2012 8:40:31 GMT -6
Carl,
If you are reading this, I e-mailed "anni." It has not been bounced, so her address seems to be still valid. I'll keep you posted.
Best wishes, Fred.
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Post by benteen on May 8, 2012 11:15:39 GMT -6
Capt,
I have another web site that has all the soldiers listed and according to this he was born May 1st 1854 in Boston Mass his occupation was salesman, enlisted in 1875, buried where you said he was.
Be Well Dan
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Post by fred on May 8, 2012 13:05:23 GMT -6
I have another web site that has all the soldiers listed and according to this he was born May 1st 1854 in Boston Mass.... Dan, Those Websites know no more than anyone else and they are just picking up the data from enlistment records. Morris lied because he was underage. I just "spoke" to a family member and they believe that is precisely why he enlisted using phony dates. I have ruled out the 1861 date, and am leaning toward the 1858 date. Morris enlisted in September, 1875, and gave his birth date as May 1, [whatever]. I believe the May 1, but if his real date were 1861, that would make him only 14 and I don't believe he could get away with that. He could, however, get away with passing for 21 if he was 17 or 18, and if he were born in 1857, then he would have been 18 when he enlisted, or 17 if the 1858 date were accurate. So I would venture to say, 1858 is the correct number. Best wishes, Fred.
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Post by Diane Merkel on May 14, 2012 11:04:48 GMT -6
As I recall, there were other problems with the judge's story. I've never been convinced the judge and the guy at LBH were the same, but I haven't looked at it in many years. Maybe one of these days . . . .
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annl
New Member
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Post by annl on Oct 9, 2012 21:07:31 GMT -6
Diane--they are the same...I can trace him in my family history. I can't vouch that his letter/story is 100% correct, but the judge is the same as the 7th Calvary soldier. His half brother (Tabox) joined the 7th with him. There are letters between the families.
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