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Post by barbaramorris on Mar 26, 2007 0:34:35 GMT -6
I need advise.......I have a copy of his death certificate which states he was 75 at death on November 26, 1933. This would give his DOB 1858. The obit. in the newspaper lists him as 72. His marriage certificate of Nov. 7, 1879 says "birthday next" as 22 which would then be 1857. In an article in "The Bronx and It's People"(pg.265) it states that he was born in Boston, Ma. on May 1,1861. The listing here says DOB as May 1, 1854. Which is correct........1854, 1857, 1861 or is there still more ? Please respond to bmorris@consolidated.net THANKS !
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Post by fred on Mar 26, 2007 9:29:46 GMT -6
Barbara--
Here is what I have on William Morris:
PVT Morris, William Ephraim—b. Boston, MA, 1May54; d. NYC, 26Nov1933. Brown eyes, auburn hair, fair complexion; 5’7 1/2” tall. Enlisted 22Sep75 in Boston. WIA in left breast while climbing the bluffs. Fractured a bone in his forearm in 1877 in a drunken brawl & was discharged as a “private of worthless character.” Became a lawyer & judge in the Bronx. According to Willert, it was Morris who tried to save LT Hodgson by having Hodgson grab onto Morris’ stirrup [LBH Diary, p. 319], though he also quotes Slaper as claiming it was TMP Fischer & Davern saying an M Company trumpeter. • Married Arah Abbie, 7Dec79; child, William E., Jr. • Attended 50th anniversary celebration of the LBH fight, 25Jun1926. • Buried in Grave 1, Lot 7471, Section 178, Kensico Cemetery.
Kensico Cemetery is fairly near where I have a second home in New York. I will be there in May and if you want, I can easily go there and see what the gravestone says. (Some how, I think you may have already done that.) It would be my pleasure.
Best wishes, Fred.
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Post by fred on Mar 26, 2007 9:37:35 GMT -6
Barbara--
One other thing. That DOB is from enlistment rosters.
Best wishes, Fred.
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Post by harpskiddie on Mar 26, 2007 23:30:22 GMT -6
I believe that Morris himself wrote that he lied about his age at enlistment - I know that I have seen it somewhere by someone. This was not really very uncommon in the day. A lot of the 21 year olds were considerably less.
But, given that he lied, it still doesn't lead to the true DOB. My guess would be that the marriage certificate has the real deal, since it is direct information from him, with no reason to becloud the issue.
Gordie
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Post by d o harris on Mar 27, 2007 9:59:58 GMT -6
In the late fall 1878 the Bismarck Tribune reported an hunting accident at Fort Rice. William Morris shot a fellow trooper named Denise in the leg, that had to be amputated. That may be one more hit than he scored at LBH.
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Post by harpskiddie on Mar 27, 2007 11:11:37 GMT -6
I hope she wasn't hurt too badly!!!
Gordie
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Post by Scout on Apr 8, 2007 11:28:25 GMT -6
d o...where can I find the source for what you wrote about Morris accidentally shooting a trooper named Denise in 1878? I thought he was thrown out of the service the year before.
I love the part about him being a person of "worthless character" and then becoming a judge!
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Post by d o harris on Apr 8, 2007 16:18:05 GMT -6
Scout, I picked it from the Bismarck Tribune. I'll try to find the copy and give you the date the story appeared. As I recall, the Tribune did not mention the date of the incident.
Yeah, I thought the same. Discharged from the Army as a person of worthless character, then becoming a judge in New York City. That sounds about right.
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Post by d o harris on Apr 9, 2007 6:37:49 GMT -6
Scout, the article appeared in the Bismarck Tribune Nov. 1878. I did not note the specific date, but it would have been on a Wednesday, the 2nd, 9th, 16th, 23rd, or 30th.
The entire article reads: "Wm Morris, pvt, M troop, veteran of Little Big Horn Valley and hilltop fights, accidentally shot pvt. Denise, of M, through left leg while the two were hunting prairie chickens. Pvt. Denise's leg had to be amputated."
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Post by Scout on Apr 9, 2007 9:05:29 GMT -6
d o...thanks so much for the follow up.This is an interesting article. Records show Morris discharged, or rather thrown out, in Dec. 1877. Here it is nearly a year later...Nov. 1878 and he's listed as still in the service? Company M is correct...have any thoughts on what's going on here? I'm looking at 'Men with Custer.'
Could it have been an old article the paper ran?Could he have stayed on as a civilian worker? Anyone know anything about Pvt. Denise? Knowing old Willie's personality I wonder if it was an accident.
you know this will drive me crazy don't you? Super sleuths where are you?
Thanks again d o.
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Post by markland on Apr 9, 2007 9:12:54 GMT -6
Scout & D.O., I will take a look at the regimental returns for Nov. '78 to see if any further info is available.
Billy
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Post by d o harris on Apr 9, 2007 9:57:22 GMT -6
An old article is a possibility. I went through most of 1876, then from Sept '78 through Feb '79. One thing that I did notice was small blurbs from Ft Rice or Lincoln, such as the Morris article were apparently set in type and then sometimes shelved until space permitted publication. Advertising came first.
The only thing certain to be printed in a timely manner in '78-'79 were the weekly receptions at the quarters of Col. & Mrs. Sturgis. Knowing the way Lounsberry ran his paper the news from the Sturgis household may have been a paid advertisement. I got the distinct impression daughter Ella was being marketed.
Of course, Custer would have been news, but from Dec. 1 '75 until May 17 '76 I don't believe he was at FAL more than 16 or 17 days, and I didn't discover anything useful.
The Morris article, and the ones on Mrs. Nash, and some others I printed and kept because they added interesting, and comical sidelights to events. Lounsberry, or, rather, whoever was stringing for him from the military posts, was often careless with his facts, and spelling. He recorded Benteen present at the Sturgis New Years reception Jan. 1, '79, which must have been a good trick, since I believe he registered at the Palmer house Jan. 2. And Cpl. Rowland, not at the LBH, made the news as Roland, charged with murdering a teamster at a Jan. 1 celebration.
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Post by markland on Apr 9, 2007 10:44:27 GMT -6
7CRR1277 states William E. Morris, co. M, discharged due to disability, 12/11/1877 at Ft. A. Lincoln.
7CRR1178 states George E. Morris was discharged due to disability on 11/28/1878 at Camp Ruhlen, DT [Ft. Meade].
There is no mention of anyone with a surname of Denise or any variant being discharged through 04/1879. However, in the 1178 return, there is a recruit assigned to co. M named Jacob Neince (or something close) on detached service at Ft. Lincoln since 11/20/1878.
Perhaps the recruit shot G. E. Morris rather than Morris shooting him? Of course that is a major assumption with no relationship to facts!
Isn't anything ever straightforward about this blessed regiment??
Billy
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Post by elisabeth on Apr 9, 2007 11:12:10 GMT -6
It seems not!
Wasn't there a fantastic story, also in the BT, of Wallace being killed on a hunting expedition in the New Year of '76? A bit rum, as I believe he was also reported as being present at the Sturgis New Year party ... Had been tempted to wonder if it wasn't a Godfatherish threat as to what might happen to him if he didn't toe the line with his RCOI testimony. But it begins to look as if Lounsberry was running the National Enquirer of his day, and just writing whatever sprang to his feverish imagination!
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Post by d o harris on Apr 9, 2007 11:44:51 GMT -6
Okay, Billy. Now you guys have got me wondering. The George Morris I knew about was killed with Keogh and I. The Neince seems correct to be either victim or shooter. The stringer from Rice was probably a sergeant who wrote his J's like D's and J Neince was read as Denise. A trooper from I would be unlikely. I think Benteen was there as C.O., and it seems when he had a choice he took M with his H. In any event, around the same period the Trib ran an article commending Benteen for stopping the illegal whisky trade around Ft Rice.
The story on Wallace was that he'd gone deer hunting in Montana, was lost and probably dead. Two weeks later he is listed as a guest at the NY Day reception at the Sturgis'. (It was reported Ella attended as a Moroccan Princess. I don't know if this means she had an exposed navel, rings and bells on her toes, or simply had her face veiled.)
In December the Trib ran an article listing the officers who had departed for the RCOI in Chicago. Wallace was not listed, but Benteen was, and the guests reported at the reception included Capt. & Mrs. Benteen. Then at RCOI, when recalled to answer questions related to Reno's alleged drinking, Wallace mentions offhandedly that he arrived in Chicago on the 2nd.
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